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Author Topic: Billy Graham has died  (Read 14348 times)

bluehillside Retd.

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Billy Graham has died
« on: February 21, 2018, 02:39:38 PM »
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Humph Warden Bennett

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2018, 02:44:05 PM »
Worse have walked the Earth than Billy.

RIP.
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ippy

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2018, 02:44:56 PM »
It'll be interesting to see how much he has left in his will, if it doesn't amount to very much I'd like to know how it's been covered up just how much he has really left.

Regards ippy
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Humph Warden Bennett

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2018, 02:47:15 PM »
Quote from: ippy on February 21, 2018, 02:44:56 PM
It'll be interesting to see how much he has left in his will, if it doesn't amount to very much I'd like to know how it's been covered up just how much he has really left.

Regards ippy

Not the time for snide comments.

Grow up.
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Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2018, 02:58:52 PM »
I'm wondering if any media will show clips of Billy in full flow.
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SusanDoris

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2018, 03:08:23 PM »
My first reaction when reading topic title was: about time too.

How many people did he delude into thinking God loved them, etc, persuading them to come forward and all that stuff.
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Humph Warden Bennett

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2018, 03:15:52 PM »
Quote from: SusanDoris on February 21, 2018, 03:08:23 PM
My first reaction when reading topic title was: about time too.

How many people did he delude into thinking God loved them, etc, persuading them to come forward and all that stuff.

As I wrote above worse people have walked the Earth than Billy Graham.

As I recall, you have written here that you would tell a dying person words to the effect of "You are going to die, nothing will be left of you other than an empty shell, get on with it".

I have little time for Evangelicals, but I would rather spend my last moments with an evangelical, than with an unpleasant anti theist.
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Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2018, 03:16:54 PM »
Quote from: SusanDoris on February 21, 2018, 03:08:23 PM
My first reaction when reading topic title was: about time too.

How many people did he delude into thinking God loved them, etc, persuading them to come forward and all that stuff.
Are you offering this up as proof you can be moral without religion?

The Secular websites and Atheist rant sites are going to be a real treat for us outsiders of secular humanism tonight.
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Nearly Sane

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2018, 03:18:45 PM »
Quote from: SusanDoris on February 21, 2018, 03:08:23 PM
My first reaction when reading topic title was: about time too.

How many people did he delude into thinking God loved them, etc, persuading them to come forward and all that stuff.
So when my sainted mother dies, I'm supposed to think 'About time too', given she brought me up in her religion?
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Rhiannon

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #9 on: February 21, 2018, 03:25:09 PM »
His influence on Anglicanism remains huge. He started the drive towards Evangelicalism which has resulted in the church being less welcoming and tolerant. I do wonder how he could raise a son so lacking in morality.
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bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2018, 03:26:18 PM »
NS,

Quote
So when my sainted mother dies, I'm supposed to think 'About time too', given she brought me up in her religion?

If she was also a virulent anti-semite and palpable fraud who built a career on lying to young people you might be inclined to: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1hl2jdfIiA
« Last Edit: February 21, 2018, 03:30:40 PM by bluehillside Retd. »
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Humph Warden Bennett

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2018, 03:34:28 PM »
Quote from: bluehillside Retd. on February 21, 2018, 03:26:18 PM
NS,

If she was also a virulent anti-semite and palpable fraud who built a career on lying to young people you might be inclined to: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1hl2jdfIiA

Can I intrude here?

Billy Graham did not like Catholics either, but then neither did Ian Paisley. But Paisley, Graham, or for that matter Praise God Barebones, did not endorse killing anybody. Get over it.
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Nearly Sane

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #12 on: February 21, 2018, 03:35:42 PM »
Quote from: bluehillside Retd. on February 21, 2018, 03:26:18 PM
NS,

If she was also a virulent anti-semite and palpable fraud who built a career on lying to young people you might be inclined to: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1hl2jdfIiA
Are you sure he was lying? If so, how?
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bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2018, 03:36:40 PM »
Humph,

Quote
Can I intrude here?

Billy Graham did not like Catholics either, but then neither did Ian Paisley. But Paisley, Graham, or for that matter Praise God Barebones, did not endorse killing anybody. Get over it.

Get over what?
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bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #14 on: February 21, 2018, 03:39:57 PM »
NS,

Quote
Are you sure he was lying? If so, how?

Hitchens thought he was a palpable fraud, but I'm not "sure" about anything.   
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Humph Warden Bennett

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #15 on: February 21, 2018, 03:43:24 PM »
Quote from: bluehillside Retd. on February 21, 2018, 03:36:40 PM
Humph,

Get over what?

Your dislike of evangelical christians. They are not bad people per se. If you do not like their message then ignore it. I do.

(OK If I am bored I argue with the Baptists in our local High Street on Friday morning, but I do not see them as fundamentally bad people).
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Nearly Sane

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #16 on: February 21, 2018, 03:45:16 PM »
Quote from: bluehillside Retd. on February 21, 2018, 03:39:57 PM
NS,

Hitchens thought he was a palpable fraud, but I'm not "sure" about anything.
I'm sure I'm typing this - that isn't a claim to absolute certainty because as a colloquial everyday sense, saying you are sure about something isn't claiming that. Mentioning Hitchens here is worthless, I want to know why you were sure enough to type that he was lying, and a citation of Hitchens gives me no reason to believe you were right to be so sure in your statement
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Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #17 on: February 21, 2018, 03:48:57 PM »
Quote from: bluehillside Retd. on February 21, 2018, 03:39:57 PM
NS,

Hitchens thought he was a palpable fraud, but I'm not "sure" about anything.
Apparently Dean Martin said that when he shook Graham's hand his right arm sobered up.
Did Hitchens ever meet Graham?
« Last Edit: February 21, 2018, 03:52:06 PM by Private Frazer »
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Anchorman

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #18 on: February 21, 2018, 03:50:46 PM »
"Well done, good and faithful servant; enter into your rest." I met him once =- at Mission Scotland, Celtic Park, where I was a coounsellor. As far as finances go, I have no idea...however I DO know  that the offerings from Mission Scotland went to local churches projects working with the homelerss, such as Calton, Bethany, etc...and that all accounts for the missdion were independently audited. The BGEA organised the events...and, as per usual, opened up their accounts to independent scrutiny. This was no televangelist outfit.
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Anchorman

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2018, 03:51:58 PM »
Quote from: SusanDoris on February 21, 2018, 03:08:23 PM
My first reaction when reading topic title was: about time too.

How many people did he delude into thinking God loved them, etc, persuading them to come forward and all that stuff.


Lives were changed.
I know a few who, by being changed, have changed the lives of others.
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"for, as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be brought under English rule. It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom - for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself."

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #20 on: February 21, 2018, 03:57:05 PM »
NS,

Quote
I'm sure I'm typing this - that isn't a claim to absolute certainty because as a colloquial everyday sense, saying you are sure about something isn't claiming that. Mentioning Hitchens here is worthless, I want to know why you were sure enough to type that he was lying, and a citation of Hitchens gives me no reason to believe you were right to be so sure in your statement

What point do you think you’re making here? Hitchens I find to be generally reliable in such matters, and if we’re talking “sure” in the colloquial, everyday sense then for colloquial, everyday purposes that’s a citation. If instead you actually mean the, “would it stand up in the courts?” sense for example though then it probably isn’t (except perhaps as a character witness).

Whether BG’s mis-statements about (among other things) American history were lies or just mistakes (or propaganda) is moot, but his anti-semitism is on tape. He apologised for it afterwards, (“I just got caught up in the conversation”) but it’s unpleasant stuff at best. The New York Times and the Washington Post both have balance obits.           
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Anchorman

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #21 on: February 21, 2018, 03:58:25 PM »
Quote from: Humph Warden Bennett on February 21, 2018, 03:34:28 PM
Can I intrude here?

Billy Graham did not like Catholics either, but then neither did Ian Paisley. But Paisley, Graham, or for that matter Praise God Barebones, did not endorse killing anybody. Get over it.




Humph; Mission Scotland took place in Celtic Park (home of Glasgow Celtic, famously known for its RC roots)
I was a counsellor there that week.
Some of the prayers were conducted by John Fitsimmons, a very well known RC Priest, sadly no longer with us.
The notorious bigot 'Pastor' Jack Glass handed out flyers each night denouncing Graham for having met and prayed with the Pope.
Mind you, said Pastor was infamous for doing the same thing, year after year, outside the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland....apparently he nearly blew a fuse when an RC archbishop was warmly welcomed and invited to speak to us one year.
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"for, as long as but a hundred of us remain alive, never will we on any conditions be brought under English rule. It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom - for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself."

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #22 on: February 21, 2018, 03:58:36 PM »
Anchs,

Quote
Lives were changed.
I know a few who, by being changed, have changed the lives of others.

For the better or for the worse? Or both?
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Nearly Sane

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #23 on: February 21, 2018, 03:59:39 PM »
Quote from: bluehillside Retd. on February 21, 2018, 03:57:05 PM
NS,

What point do you think you’re making here? Hitchens I find to be generally reliable in such matters, and if we’re talking “sure” in the colloquial, everyday sense then for colloquial, everyday purposes that’s a citation. If instead you actually mean the, “would it stand up in the courts?” sense for example though then it probably isn’t (except perhaps as a character witness).

Whether BG’s mis-statements about (among other things) American history were lies or just mistakes (or propaganda) is moot, but his anti-semitism is on tape. He apologised for it afterwards, (“I just got caught up in the conversation”) but it’s unpleasant stuff at best. The New York Times and the Washington Post both have balance obits.         
Citing Hitchens isn't evidence - not sure why you are asking about the anti semitism as I didn't questions that.
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Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: Billy Graham has died
« Reply #24 on: February 21, 2018, 04:07:09 PM »
Hitchens?
On another board Dicky Underpants knocked me for referring to John of the apocalypse because apparently he was a ''Drug Fuelled'' fanatic.
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