Prominent antitheist suspended

[Walt Zingmatilder]

What topic and what implications?

Some guy who's a scientist and an atheist has been accused of misconduct - whether he turns out to be guilty or not, I don't see what there is to discuss or what implications there might be for theism or atheism (this section of the forum).

Reference to the AHA link demonstrates the implications for atheist and humanist communities .

[Nearly Sane]

Reference to the AHA link demonstrates the implications for atheist and humanist communities .

In what way? Again asked for yet another time.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

In what way? Again asked for yet another time.

Are you asking what I think the implications are? I don't want to publicly comment on that at the moment.
The AHA have given a statement on the significance for them and they have been linked. I don't therefore understand why you'd rather interrogate me.

[bluehillside Retd.]

What I cannot understand is given the issue some have concluded that the only issue here is what I personally am up to. Unless they are using it as a diversion from the main issue.

The only issue is what Vlad is up to - ie, putting "antitheist" and "suspended" together in the hope of slurring one by implied association with the the other.

There is no other "main issue".

[Walt Zingmatilder]

The only issue is what Vlad is up to - ie, putting "antitheist" and "suspended" together in the hope of slurring one by implied association with the the other.

There is no other "main issue".

Hillside, was a prominent antitheist suspended or not?

Why was this prominent antitheist suspended? Is the reason ''not an issue?''

[Nearly Sane]

Are you asking what I think the implications are? I don't want to publicly comment on that at the moment.
The AHA have given a statement on the significance for them and they have been linked. I don't therefore understand why you'd rather interrogate me.

Because you think and have said there are implications and issues and have been asked what you think they are. Why are you evading answering continually?

[bluehillside Retd.]

Here's what the World Economic Forum tells us Krauss is actually "prominent" for:

Theoretical Physicist. Professor, School of Earth and Space Exploration, Arizona State University. Chair of the Board, Bulletin of Atomic Scientists. Member of the Board, Federation of American Scientists. Director, Origins Project, exploring issues from the origin of universe to consciousness. Columnist. Author of several international bestselling books. Subject of a feature film documentary. Recipient of awards: Lilienfeld Prize, APS; Oersted Medal, AAPT; Gemant Award, AIP & NSF Public Welfare Medal, the only physicist to have been awarded all three prizes by major US physics organizations. Research interests: interface between elementary particle physics and cosmology.

https://www.weforum.org/people/lawrence-m-krauss

None of which would have anything to do with the accusations he faces in any case.

Here's what Vlad posted to make his slur by association:

"Prominent antitheist suspended".

Disgraceful, and not made any better by the floundering for a justification that's followed.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Because you think and have said there are implications and issues and have been asked what you think they are. Why are you evading answering continually?

I'm not have given links to where the implications and links are outlined and also I have said that I will outline what I think they are in future.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Here's what the World Economic Forum tells us Krauss is actually "prominent" for:

Theoretical Physicist. Professor, School of Earth and Space Exploration, Arizona State University. Chair of the Board, Bulletin of Atomic Scientists. Member of the Board, Federation of American Scientists. Director, Origins Project, exploring issues from the origin of universe to consciousness. Columnist. Author of several international bestselling books. Subject of a feature film documentary. Recipient of awards: Lilienfeld Prize, APS; Oersted Medal, AAPT; Gemant Award, AIP & NSF Public Welfare Medal, the only physicist to have been awarded all three prizes by major US physics organizations. Research interests: interface between elementary particle physics and cosmology.

https://www.weforum.org/people/lawrence-m-krauss

Not a full account of his activities I'm afraid. You can't go far wrong with Wikipedia though.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Not a full account of his activities I'm afraid. You can't go far wrong with Wikipedia though.

In which Vlad goes wrong twice:

1. He regularly does "go far wrong" when his references to Wiki blow up in his face; and

2. "A full account of" and "being prominent for" are not the same thing at all.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

In which Vlad goes wrong twice:

1. He regularly does "go far wrong" when his references to Wiki blow up in his face; and

I think people can read wikipedia for themselves, don't you Hillside.

[Nearly Sane]

I'm not have given links to where the implications and links are outlined and also I have said that I will outline what I think they are in future.

You have said you think there are issues and implications, just refused to answer when asked what they are and then chided others for not knowing what they are. It's a deeply dishonest approach.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

You have said you think there are issues and implications, just refused to answer when asked what they are and then chided others for not knowing what they are. It's a deeply dishonest approach.

Then we will have to agree to disagree.
There is ample information through links given by me to get the idea. If you haven't read the press release from the American Humanist association I suggest you do so in full.

[Nearly Sane]

Then we will have to agree to disagree.
There is ample information through links given by me to get the idea. If you haven't read the press release from the American Humanist association I suggest you do so in full.

No, we will have to agree as you just have here that despite being asked multiple times you haven't answered what you see as the issues and implications. Stop lying

[Robbie]

PrivateF, I got this from your link"-

“It’s deeply disappointing when someone we’ve honored, and who regularly speaks to the world representing humanists everywhere, fails to meet our expectations. When a prominent humanist’s commitment to reason, compassion, and egalitarianism appears to be fundamentally compromised by his or her behavior, we must act on our disappointment to ensure that the world understands humanists at large don’t condone such misconduct,”

However if you're trying to compare this case to cases where religious people have committed sexual misdemeanours, there's a vast difference.

A religious person may well use religiosity as a cover for acts of abuse, almost a protection, which is horrendous & is how so many got away with it in the past.

An 'antitheist' as you describe him is not going to be able to hide behind his antitheism any more than an eminent geographer would be shielded by geography.

[bluehillside Retd.]

NS,

It's a deeply dishonest approach.

Standard Vlad playbook bait and switch: claim something to be the case, refuse to tell us what it is, demand that other tell him what it is, criticise them for not knowing. 

Presumably if Krauss had happened to be a collector of matchboxes Vlad wouldn't have posted, "Prominent matchbox collector suspended" though.

Funny that.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

NS,
Presumably if Krauss had happened to be a collector of matchboxes Vlad wouldn't have posted, "Prominent matchbox collector suspended" though.

Funny that.

Pure conjecture and another example of Hillside's mind reading act. I'm sure it would be appropriately mentioned on a matchbox collectors site.

[Stranger]

I'm not have given links to where the implications and links are outlined and also I have said that I will outline what I think they are in future.

But the links do not contain any general implications. This guy has been accused and those organisations that he is associated with have taken the actions they think appropriate with regard to him.

What do you think are the implications?

[Walt Zingmatilder]

But the links do not contain any general implications. This guy has been accused and those organisations that he is associated with have taken the actions they think appropriate with regard to him.

What do you think are the implications?

I think it's too soon to say and I wouldn't want to prejudice anything. That's me...... though implications are already occuring in the New Atheist community.

[Nearly Sane]

I think it's too soon to say and I wouldn't want to prejudice anything. That's me...... though implications are already occuring in the New Atheist community.

Apart from being further evasion/lying here, it's also nonsensical. You have already said you have given links covering the issues/implications and chided people for not reading them fully, and now you say it is too soon to say but that are already implications. Fatuous lying drivel

[Walt Zingmatilder]

https://www.goodreads.com/author_blog_posts/16511467-the-lawrence-krauss-affair

https://forum.samharris.org/?URL=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2F3vuBhKPy1As

[Nearly Sane]

https://www.goodreads.com/author_blog_posts/16511467-the-lawrence-krauss-affair

https://forum.samharris.org/?URL=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2F3vuBhKPy1As

And? What implicatiins /issues do you think there are?

[Stranger]

I think it's too soon to say and I wouldn't want to prejudice anything.

You started the discussion!

That's me...... though implications are already occuring in the New Atheist community.

Like what? What the fuck has this guy's alleged actions got to do with atheism or theism (this forum section) in general? Let's say, for the sake of argument, that somebody with similar views in a similar situation, was actually found to be guilty of this sort of thing - then what?

And who hell is the "New Atheist community" anyway?

[bluehillside Retd.]

Pure conjecture and another example of Hillside's mind reading act. I'm sure it would be appropriately mentioned on a matchbox collectors site.

Where the members who are brighter and less scummy than Vlad would say:

1. Why have you posted this at all as it’s just a story about an academic facing charges so there’s nothing relevant to discuss? 

2. If you must post it why do it here rather than in journals dedicated to the fields of endeavour for which he’s better known, like physics and cosmology?

3. What the hell does this have to do with the merits or demerits of phillumenism in any case, despite your sleazy attempt to link it with allegations of misconduct?

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Apart from being further evasion/lying here, it's also nonsensical. You have already said you have given links covering the issues/implications and chided people for not reading them fully, and now you say it is too soon to say but that are already implications. Fatuous lying drivel

Do people contributing to this post look as though they are acknowledging the issue here and it's implications for Theism and atheism? I would say they look as if they aren't and that isn't a good look.

I acknowledge Robbies statement that the religious find themselves in the same position. But it remains that a) Communities have to take accusations seriously b) that the suspension of links between prominent atheists and atheist organisations is a significant development in the history of contemporary atheism c) that Dr Krauss is the subject of enquiry and not as yet judgment and thus the question is are the suspension of links justified?

And in view of that what are we to make of using this thread, rather than in consideration of all this, to jump on Vlad. That looks the Fred and Ginger of displacement behaviour.