Jack Whitehall cast as gay Disney character

[Harrowby Hall]

Did I see some suggestion a few days ago that the next James Bond could be black?

[Nearly Sane]

Did I see some suggestion a few days ago that the next James Bond could be black?

You did. Idris Elba. And?

[Harrowby Hall]

What do you mean ... "and" ... ?

Was this not a perfectly reasonable observation to make in view of the subject of this thread? Or were you looking for an argument?

[Rhiannon]

A point of view.

https://www.newstatesman.com/culture/film/2018/08/jack-whitehall-disney-straight-actor-first-gay-character-problem

[Nearly Sane]

What do you mean ... "and" ... ?

Was this not a perfectly reasonable observation to make in view of the subject of this thread? Or were you looking for an argument?

I wondered what point you were making. I am still not sure.

[jeremyp]

So if there aren't any where enough near good enough female roles, is that not an issue?

Of course it is. In fact it is the real issue in respect of women getting good parts in plays and movies. Apologies if that didn't come through in my previous post.

[jeremyp]

Applause!

Othello was one of our O level texts in Eng. Lit. Our English teacher had great fun in explaining to us what the line I quoted meant, since IIRC none of knew the verb "to tup".

[Nearly Sane]

Of course it is. In fact it is the real issue in respect of women getting good parts in plays and movies. Apologies if that didn't come through in my previous post.

No problem. Thank you for the clarification.

[jeremyp]

Did I see some suggestion a few days ago that the next James Bond could be black?

That's an interesting case. For me, the character of James Bond is white English upper class. A lot of his backstory is predicated on that. A black super spy working for British intelligence would be a different character and the only reason to call that character "James Bond" is box office. I'm not saying it wouldn't work and, to be honest, the existing formula tried my patience a bit in the last two films - I'd definitely pay to see Idris Elba as Bond.

Well, I'd pay to see anybody good as Bond. For some reason Scarlet Johansson as "Jane Bond" just popped into my head.

[Rhiannon]

Othello was one of our O level texts in Eng. Lit. Our English teacher had great fun in explaining to us what the line I quoted meant, since IIRC none of knew the verb "to tup".

Now I realise just how much of an in-the-sticks dweller I really am.

[Rhiannon]

That's an interesting case. For me, the character of James Bond is white English upper class. A lot of his backstory is predicated on that. A black super spy working for British intelligence would be a different character and the only reason to call that character "James Bond" is box office. I'm not saying it wouldn't work and, to be honest, the existing formula tried my patience a bit in the last two films - I'd definitely pay to see Idris Elba as Bond.

Well, I'd pay to see anybody good as Bond. For some reason Scarlet Johansson as "Jane Bond" just popped into my head.

And I'm thinking of Ace Rimmer.

[Nearly Sane]

That's an interesting case. For me, the character of James Bond is white English upper class. A lot of his backstory is predicated on that. A black super spy working for British intelligence would be a different character and the only reason to call that character "James Bond" is box office. I'm not saying it wouldn't work and, to be honest, the existing formula tried my patience a bit in the last two films - I'd definitely pay to see Idris Elba as Bond.

Well, I'd pay to see anybody good as Bond. For some reason Scarlet Johansson as "Jane Bond" just popped into my head.

Gillian Anderson suggested herself for the role. I get what you say about the character, though that seems about the books rather than the films, and the upper class bit went when they cast Connery. I think the films have almost no back story for Bond.

[Nearly Sane]

Now I realise just how much of an in-the-sticks dweller I really am.

It's odd, isn't it? I don't think I knew the word when I did Othello either though I can't be sure, but certainly some people in my class would have when we studied it, because they came from more rural backgrounds.  It's always sounded Yorkshire in my head.

[Nearly Sane]

A point of view.

https://www.newstatesman.com/culture/film/2018/08/jack-whitehall-disney-straight-actor-first-gay-character-problem

Some interesting points, not quite sure I understand the take on Neil Patrick Harris and Russell Tovey.

[Rhiannon]

It's odd, isn't it? I don't think I knew the word when I did Othello either though I can't be sure, but certainly some people in my cla s would have when we studied it, because they came from more rural backgrounds.  It's always sounded Yorkshire in my head.

I don't even live in sheep country, it's arable here. I think it must have something to do with what I read as a consequence of living in the country. I even know why ewes have coloured bottoms.

https://www.thenaturalfibre.co.uk/blog/time-tup

[Rhiannon]

Some interesting points, not quite sure I understand the take on Neil Patrick Harris and Russell Tovey.

No, I don't agree with all of it. I think though that I can understand how a group that feel marginalised in society (even if that isn't reflected in the film world in the same way) must feel about seeing a big first played by a straight guy. Like there are no gay actors who could play that part.

[Nearly Sane]

No, I don't agree with all of it. I think though that I can understand how a group that feel marginalised in society (even if that isn't reflected in the film world in the same way) must feel about seeing a big first played by a straight guy. Like there are no gay actors who could play that part.

I hadn't even thought of the sexuality of the actors in Call Me By Your Name, though I don't see a problem in the clauses asked for. And again, I hadn't considered if any openly gay actors had won Oscars. It makes valid points that even in a relatively accepting area of work, there is still miles to go.

[Harrowby Hall]

I think the films have almost no back story for Bond.

The only one I can think of is Skyfall.

[Nearly Sane]

The only one I can think of is Skyfall.

Good point, just made me realise that's one of the reasons I find it problematic. My film idea of Bond is that he sprung out of M's mind, rather like Athena and Zeus, with less axe.


My book Bond is very different.

To pull it back to thread, what about a gay Bond?

[Rhiannon]

Just found this.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/14/maurice-film-merchant-ivory-gay-love-relationships

[Nearly Sane]

First saw Maurice in a double bill wiih My Beautiful Launderette

[jeremyp]

Gillian Anderson suggested herself for the role. I get what you say about the character, though that seems about the books rather than the films, and the upper class bit went when they cast Connery. I think the films have almost no back story for Bond.

Skyfall and Spectre are all about Bond's backstory.

[Nearly Sane]

Skyfall and Spectre are all about Bond's backstory.

Out of how many films?