Brexit isn't breaking Britain, it's happening because it was broken?

[Nearly Sane]

I was tempted to put this on the Brexit thread but it's about a wider issue. I don't agree within of it but it is coruscating in its anger and I think does argue an institutional corruption that many on either side of Brexit support.


That the scandal of this govt 's approach to the sick, the disabled, the poor, ethnic minorities is just business as fucking usual is damning. We are happy to create a sugar tax, but any indication that our hunger for meat might be destroying the planet isn't something that we should do anything about as that would be the nanny state.

https://www.opendemocracy.net/uk/brexitinc/adam-ramsay/brexit-is-showing-urban-middle-classes-real-britain

[Rhiannon]

Actually the sugar tax/meat thing reflects that we are a nation of bullies who like to scapegoat. We can pretend that fat shaming and tackling the 'obesity epidemic' is about helping people to live more healthily but actually it is about our need as a society to control and expect conformity. But most people eat meat and there are no votes to be had in making steak pricier. Ditto smoking/alcohol. We can all feel self-righteous about the smoking ban, but a drinking limit? Nah, mate.

Yes, this government are disgusting, but so is Labour's divide and rule - it's just done in reverse. This isn't something I have evidence for links to but I feel that those in power hate us.

[Nearly Sane]

Actually the sugar tax/meat thing reflects that we are a nation of bullies who like to scapegoat. We can pretend that fat shaming and tackling the 'obesity epidemic' is about helping people to live more healthily but actually it is about our need as a society to control and expect conformity. But most people eat meat and there are no votes to be had in making steak pricier. Ditto smoking/alcohol. We can all feel self-righteous about the smoking ban, but a drinking limit? Nah, mate.

Yes, this government are disgusting, but so is Labour's divide and rule - it's just done in reverse. This isn't something I have evidence for links to but I feel that those in power hate us.

In pointing out the disgusting racist murdering actions of this govy, I am not recommending another party. And I think the article is right that it is hard to be doing well and not be complicit in some way. I don't think those in power actually do much hating rather I think there is an attitude of this is the best we can do. We ameliorate our worst characteristics in a sort of puny realpolitik.

And to be fair,  I know of no easy way to do anything that doesn't involve dirty hands in some way. As Prof Davey said recentlY, I have no real idea why anyone would get involved in politics. There was a time when I used to think the compromises were reasonable. That may well have just been naivete but now it seems a poisoned chalice. I note that Caroline Lucas has just been defending John Bercow for bullying because those seeking to attack him are bullying.  Really, Caroline?

[Rhiannon]

I'm astonished when I see people living life like there isn't anything wrong.

[Nearly Sane]

Listening to the debate on Bercow is turning my stomach. No one seems to care about those bullied, it's simply party political point scoring.

[Rhiannon]

Surely not.

And you think these people don't hate us? Maybe hate is too strong a word. They just don't give a shit. Maybe it is that.

[Nearly Sane]

Surely not.

And you think these people don't hate us? Maybe hate is too strong a word. They just don't give a shit. Maybe it is that.

I think it's simply more tribal than that. It's a bit like the daft quote from Steven Weinberg that it takes religion to make good people do bad things, they are the cost of losing Bercow as Speaker as worse than the cost to the people being bullied. Or the cost for the message it sends out to those who are bullied. This is a sort of reverse Kavanaugh.

[Rhiannon]

I think it's simply more tribal than that. It's a bit like the daft quote from Steven Weinberg that it takes religion to make good people do bad things, they are the cost of losing Bercow as Speaker as worse than the cost to the people being bullied. Or the cost for the message it sends out to those who are bullied. This is a sort of reverse Kavanaugh.

Yeah but the tribalism is so deep and so pronounced that those not in the tribes at all (in this case HoP workers) are less than. We are nobodies if we stand in the way of party and parliament. Or if we ever dare to hold up a mirror to them.

[Nearly Sane]

Yeah but the tribalism is so deep and so pronounced that those not in the tribes at all (in this case HoP workers) are less than. We are nobodies if we stand in the way of party and parliament. Or if we ever dare to hold up a mirror to them.

I think generals and those who see themselves as generals always under value troops.

[Rhiannon]

I think generals and those who see themselves as generals always under value troops.

'The little people'...

[Nearly Sane]

'The little people'...

To an extent. It's the problem of seeing 'the big picture'. Anyone thinking they do almost certainly doesn't.

[Rhiannon]

This probably doesn't belong her but maybe it does.

http://newsthump.com/2018/10/16/sexually-adventurous-hippies-need-to-be-infiltrated-much-more-than-dangerous-gangs-claims-met-police/