Beyond Science

[jeremyp]

Well...I am not saying it.

Yes you are.

The article I have linked in the 'Religion Instinct?' thread says so. It clearly says that our spiritual experiences depend on brain wiring. Ask Andrew Newberg why he says what he says.

But you are implicitly assuming that your wiring is better than mine because you believe religious crap.

[Sriram]

Yes you are.
But you are implicitly assuming that your wiring is better than mine because you believe religious crap.

You people are just feeling sorry for yourselves.  'Better' and 'worse' is a relative judgement. I have not said any such thing.  According to the article, some people don't have the necessary wiring to enable them to have spiritual experiences. That is all it is.  Its sad but true. 

But there is hope for you guys!  According to the article, if necessary effort is taken through meditations, prayer etc. the wiring can change!!

So folks, start on the prayers from today ...and see the results...!  Just make sure the prayers are sincere!  Enjoy!

[SteveH]

But you will never have evidence that your experiences refer to anything objective - and it doesn't matter. The experience is the point; where it comes from is irrelevant.

[Sriram]

But you will never have evidence that your experiences refer to anything objective - and it doesn't matter. The experience is the point; where it comes from is irrelevant.

You are getting too much into the objectivity-subjectivity issue.

Life is only about experiences. Ultimately everything is subjective. Objectivity is just collective subjectivity. What you think of as objective reality is just your perception as a human with certain senses and with certain brain cells.  If you were as big as a virus or an electron, you will have a very different idea of objective reality.

As Max Planck said....

"I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness. Everything that we talk about, everything that we regard as existing, postulates consciousness."

[Maeght]

You people are just feeling sorry for yourselves.  'Better' and 'worse' is a relative judgement. I have not said any such thing.  According to the article, some people don't have the necessary wiring to enable them to have spiritual experiences. That is all it is.  Its sad but true. 

But there is hope for you guys!  According to the article, if necessary effort is taken through meditations, prayer etc. the wiring can change!!

So folks, start on the prayers from today ...and see the results...!  Just make sure the prayers are sincere!  Enjoy!

They don't have the wiring that means they interpret experiences as having a spiritual cause. That's what the article says.

[ippy]

You people are just feeling sorry for yourselves.  'Better' and 'worse' is a relative judgement. I have not said any such thing.  According to the article, some people don't have the necessary wiring to enable them to have spiritual experiences. That is all it is.  Its sad but true. 

But there is hope for you guys!  According to the article, if necessary effort is taken through meditations, prayer etc. the wiring can change!!

So folks, start on the prayers from today ...and see the results...!  Just make sure the prayers are sincere!  Enjoy!

We all have spiritual experiences Sriram, it's just that there are a lot of us that don't have a need to somehow kid ourselves there's some kind of imaginary friend waiting for us in the search for that mysterious place at the end of the rainbow or even expect to find any kind of imaginary friend anywhere.

Cheers old chap, ippy.