Post Covid 19 beliefs

[Sriram]

Hi everyone,

In the wake of the Covid 19 pandemic, has anyone's beliefs about the nature of life and death changed significantly?

Have any atheists begun to see some merit in spiritual beliefs....not necessarily in a Christian God or other specific religious beliefs?! 

Have any religious people had any change of thinking about their beliefs in God or the after-life or other supernatural things?

Any beliefs that have been further strengthened?

Any views?

Sriram

[Gordon]

No, no, no idea, and no - and it is clearly a bugger of a virus.

[Nearly Sane]

No, no, no idea, and no - and it is clearly a bugger of a virus.

Ditto

[Sebastian Toe]

Ditto

+1

[Owlswing]

As it happens I was wondering in, I suppose, a vindictive way, if Christians were going to admit that, as everything in the World and in life, good, bad and bloody awfu, came with the permission of their God it was another indisctment of just what a vindictive and unpleasant bastard He is!

And, as a result, if any of the decided that it was about time they dumped Him down the toilet!

Monty Python had it just about right in their version of "All things Bright and Beautiful!"

Yes, I know that my deities are more human in their ways and therefore one or more of them are responsible BUT that is the point! I expect some nastiness from some my deities as they are far more human than the Christian dictator.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

S it happens I was wondering in, I suppose, a vindictive way, if Christians were going to admit that, as everything in the World and in life, good, bad and bloody awfu, came with the permission of their God it was another indisctment of just what a vindictive and unpleasant bastard He is!

I see paganism hasn't tempered or moderated you or made you any happier. Anyway arguing that God is an unpleasant bastard isn't an atheist argument nor a pagan one I wouldn't imagine.

And, as a result, if any of the decided that it was about time they dumped Him down the toilet!

I haven't.

Monty Python had it just about right in their version of "All things Bright and Beautiful!"

Yes, I know that my deities are more human in their ways.

What's good about that? Since there are palpable villains here namely the Tories and their evil supporters, I would be asking whether there are still any humanists.

[Owlswing]

I see paganism hasn't tempered or moderated you or made you any happier. Anyway arguing that God is an unpleasant bastard isn't an atheist argument nor a pagan one I wouldn't imagine.

Oh, it has made me far happier than I ever was as a Christian! I have deities now who do not pretend to be omnipotent, nor do they masquerade a caring eniities while still being omnipotent deny that (or their followers - like you) they are responsible for the nasty things in the world like Covid 19! They, like the humans who worship them are fully aware of their faults, they are the same faults as humans have, of course they are, hyumans are truly made in thier image!

For an accurate asessment of your God I recommend the Monty Python version of All Things Bright and Beautiful!

I haven't.

Yeah, I've noticed - does walking around with your eyes that tight shut cause you to walk into walls and other objects?

What's good about that? Since there are palpable villains here namely the Tories and their evil supporters, I would be asking whether there are still any humanists.

Personally I am not a fan of politicians of any party, particularly an anti-Semetic leader of an anti-Semetic party and a supporter of the I R A (who, incidentally, were responsible for the murder of three fellow soldiers, off duty, out of uniform and out with their families who also died in the explosion!

Nice friends you have!

[torridon]

Hi everyone,

In the wake of the Covid 19 pandemic, has anyone's beliefs about the nature of life and death changed significantly?

Have any atheists begun to see some merit in spiritual beliefs....not necessarily in a Christian God or other specific religious beliefs?! 

Have any religious people had any change of thinking about their beliefs in God or the after-life or other supernatural things?

Any beliefs that have been further strengthened?

For many, the opposite, I think; people losing their loved ones is the last straw for a faith that was already weak.  A brush with death is a reality check, a wake up call, that can shatter illusions.

[Owlswing]

For many, the opposite, I think; people losing their loved ones is the last straw for a faith that was already weak.  A brush with death is a reality check, a wake up call, that can shatter illusions.

Agreed! OK. I have not had a close brush, but my sister-in-law has been sent home and isolated, she is a nurse, and her sister, my ex, is sweating cob-nuts as a result, she is also a nurse!

I don't quite know who are praying hardest - the Christians or the Pagans!

[SteveH]

As it happens I was wondering in, I suppose, a vindictive way, if Christians were going to admit that, as everything in the World and in life, good, bad and bloody awfu, came with the permission of their God it was another indisctment of just what a vindictive and unpleasant bastard He is!

Why does it never occur to atheists that it might be God's power that is limited, not God's love? According to the Bible, God is loove - not just loves or is loving but is love. I don't think we are ever told in the Bible that God id omnipotent: very powerful, yes, but not all-powerful. I think that idea comes from Greef philosophy. If God was necessarily all-powerful by definition, Jesus couldn't have been God incarnate, because he obviously wasn't all-powerful during his incarnation.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Oh, it has made me far happier than I ever was as a Christian! I have deities now who do not pretend to be omnipotent, nor do they masquerade a caring eniities while still being omnipotent deny that (or their followers - like you) they are responsible for the nasty things in the world like Covid 19! They, like the humans who worship them are fully aware of their faults, they are the same faults as humans have, of course they are, hyumans are truly made in thier image!

For an accurate asessment of your God I recommend the Monty Python version of All Things Bright and Beautiful!

Yeah, I've noticed - does walking around with your eyes that tight shut cause you to walk into walls and other objects?

Personally I am not a fan of politicians of any party, particularly an anti-Semetic leader of an anti-Semetic party and a supporter of the I R A (who, incidentally, were responsible for the murder of three fellow soldiers, off duty, out of uniform and out with their families who also died in the explosion!

Nice friends you have!

I hope to see Tories in front of international courts over there handling of the crisis and for crimes against humanity over herd immunity which must be the first instance of a nation like ours employing a lethal biological agent on its population as policy and subsequently using children as pit canaries. Absolutely monstrous.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

For many, the opposite, I think; people losing their loved ones is the last straw for a faith that was already weak.  A brush with death is a reality check, a wake up call, that can shatter illusions.

The illusion of progress and enlightenment as held by Pinker and Dawkins yes. A central plank of new atheism falls although to be fair the assumptions of humanism take a bigger hit since progress and capitalism are exposed as lethal by class.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

For many, the opposite, I think; people losing their loved ones is the last straw for a faith that was already weak.  A brush with death is a reality check, a wake up call, that can shatter illusions.

I think the bereaved will find their loss swept under the carpet by society both secular and non consoling.

[Sriram]

For many, the opposite, I think; people losing their loved ones is the last straw for a faith that was already weak.  A brush with death is a reality check, a wake up call, that can shatter illusions.

Not necessarily so.  For many it is death and a personal loss that makes the reality of an after-life and a purpose to life, all the more necessary.

Good times make people feel life is nothing but enjoyment and pleasure.  Bad times bring into focus our limitations and the temporal nature of life.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

As it happens I was wondering in, I suppose, a vindictive way, if Christians were going to admit that, as everything in the World and in life, good, bad and bloody awfu, came with the permission of their God it was another indisctment of just what a vindictive and unpleasant bastard He is!

And, as a result, if any of the decided that it was about time they dumped Him down the toilet!

Monty Python had it just about right in their version of "All things Bright and Beautiful!"

Yes, I know that my deities are more human in their ways and therefore one or more of them are responsible BUT that is the point! I expect some nastiness from some my deities as they are far more human than the Christian dictator.

There's a danger of weaponising bereavement in the cause of promoting anti christianity.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

For many, the opposite, I think; people losing their loved ones is the last straw for a faith that was already weak.  A brush with death is a reality check, a wake up call, that can shatter illusions.

Are you trying to find a silver lining here?

[Aruntraveller]

There's a danger of weaponising bereavement in the cause of promoting anti christianity.

As there is a danger of characterising secularism as not caring.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

As there is a danger of characterising secularism as not caring.

I think secularists should learn that their conception of the secular state as essentially benign progressive and humanist is misplaced.

[SteveH]

I think secularists should learn that their conception of the secular state as essentially benign progressive and humanist is misplaced.

It's a damn sight better than when the church ran the state.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

It's a damn sight better than when the church ran the state.

Yes, theocracies don't work. In this country though the church was never the seat of power. Dynasties and oligarchs have been.

[Aruntraveller]

I think secularists should learn that their conception of the secular state as essentially benign progressive and humanist is misplaced.

I think some religious people should recognise there is a difference between secularism and free market capitalism.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

I think some religious people should recognise there is a difference between secularism and free market capitalism.

Alas after a life time we are learning that that is effectively mere theory.

[torridon]

Not necessarily so.  For many it is death and a personal loss that makes the reality of an after-life and a purpose to life, all the more necessary.

That would be a kick back against a brush with reality, a refusal to come to terms, a deepening of our investment in escapism.  Better decision making requires that we face reality and measure up, with honesty.  This touches on why the climate problem is deeper - when people are dying in numbers, right here, right now, we can mobilise and make enormous and sudden sacrifices in our way of life.  But when the suffering is far away, decades into the future, we find it easier to procrastinate.  We need to be shocked into facing reality.

[Outrider]

In the wake of the Covid 19 pandemic, has anyone's beliefs about the nature of life and death changed significantly?

I wouldn't say that anything's significantly shifted; it's been a strange exercise in realising where people's priorities lie, in some instances, but for me personally with a small circle of friends and acquaintances it's been slightly surreal.  I know precisely no-one that's actually gone down with it, certainly no-one that's died from it, and I've been working all the way through (not a key-worker, I'm just easily capable of working from home).  The only real noticeable impact has been that Mrs. O. hasn't been able to drag us all to the beach to waste the weekends when it's sunny, which isn't really that much of a hardship.  But then the news media has been entirely inundated with it, to the point where it seems there's practically no other news at all - even the royals haven't been able to get a look in - not really sure what the significance of that stark difference between everyone else's experience (assuming that the media is on to something in their coverage) and mine.

Have any atheists begun to see some merit in spiritual beliefs....not necessarily in a Christian God or other specific religious beliefs?!

The only thing even tangentially related to spiritually that occurred to me was that the Guardian hadn't felt the need to ask Justin Welby for his input.

Any beliefs that have been further strengthened?

Not a belief, as such, but it's been reassuring to see that when the chips are down most people (at least in this country) seem to fall down on the side of trusting the science.  That said, I have this personal suspicion that when it's all blown over the excess mortality count isn't going to be that significant; the issue being that if we get something worse in our lifetimes people are going to look back on this and just adopt a 'keep calm and carry on' mentality.

O.

[ProfessorDavey]

I think the bereaved will find their loss swept under the carpet by society both secular and non consoling.

I think the bereaved will be consoled by their family, friends and their broader social network, just as has occurred in the past.