Methodists affirm gay marriage.

[Gordon]

As for bigotted I believe that gender neutral marriage should be allowed as Gender important marriages should be allowed. What is your problem with Gender important marriage considering you have one?

You are, again, avoiding the core issue: which is that some marriage providers are disallowing marriage options that are legally allowable, and in doing so they are shamefully discriminating on the basis of sexual orientation. 

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Just as an aside:

Gender Neutral Marriage?

Gender Important Marriage?

I am going to add those to the growing list of nonsense terms that are used to muddy the waters of any reasonable debate.
.

Or INFORM the debate.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

You are, again, avoiding the core issue: which is that some marriage providers are disallowing marriage options that are legally allowable, and in doing so they are shamefully discriminating on the basis of sexual orientation.

No, it is on the basis of Gender importance and partner number importance.

[Aruntraveller]

Or INFORM the debate.

If you think it's informing the debate, NEWSFLASH - it isn't

[bluehillside Retd.]

Vlad,

As for me being bigotted. I have no objection to Gender neutral marriage wherever it happens. So how can I be homophobic?

My bus company doesn't allow black people to sit in the front seats. I have no objection to black people sitting at the back though. So how can I be racist?

What is your problem with Gender important marriage considering you have one.

What's your problem with my bus policy considering you use buses?

My "problem" is that I think it's bad for society for some institutions to offer and deny the same rights and services solely on the ground of sexual orientation. That is, I think practising homophobia is wrong; you don't.     

[bluehillside Retd.]

Vlad,

Not solely. I believe that people who don't believe Gender neutral religious marriage is even a thing because there is no scriptural injunction for it should not be indulging in it because of meaninglessness.

Endlessly trying to justify your homophobia doesn't make you less of a homophobe.
 

Now that, I'm afraid doesn't solely apply to gender neutral marriage but also to polygamists.

Your were corrected on the polygamy stupidity over on the other thread. Innate characteristics and lifestyle choices are different things: you're making a basic category error here.

You of course want the wholesale destruction of the church and religion.

Perhaps if you stopped lying you'd have more time to try at least to make and argument of some kind instead? 

[Gordon]

No, it is on the basis of Gender importance and partner number importance.

Stop masquerading behind silly made-up phrases.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Not solely. I believe that people who don't believe Gender neutral religious marriage is even a thing because there is no scriptural injunction for it should not be indulging in it because of meaninglessness. 
Now that, I'm afraid doesn't solely apply to gender neutral marriage but also to polygamists. You of course want the wholesale destruction of the church and religion.

[Aruntraveller]

You don't really need to quote yourself. That just makes it a double helping of confused-ness.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Stop masquerading behind silly made-up phrases.

Vlad,

My bus company doesn't allow black people to sit in the front seats. I have no objection to black people sitting at the back though. So how can I be racist?

What's your problem with my bus policy considering you use buses?

My "problem" is that I think it's bad for society for some institutions to offer and deny the same rights and services solely on the ground of sexual orientation. That is, I think practising homophobia is wrong; you don't.     

I have no intention of not allowing the methodist church (of which I am also member by a quirk of
an ecumenical project) to conduct same sex marriages and I have no intention of schismatising with them although for the record, Trent I have thought about schismatising with the Cof E on attitudes toward current affairs.

You on the other hand seek the wholesale destruction of the church.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Vlad,

 
Your were corrected on the polygamy stupidity over on the other thread. Innate characteristics and lifestyle choices are different things: you're making a basic category error here.

Is marital choice an innate characteristic? I'm not sure it is.

[Gordon]

Is marital choice an innate characteristic? I'm not sure it is.

But the sexual orientation that informs the choice is - stop digging.

[Gordon]

You on the other hand seek the wholesale destruction of the church.

Nope - as I said earlier in the thread, I'm happy to see the on-going slow disintegration of Christianity in the UK: and if removing privileges that allow them to be homophobic in opposition to the social changes that have seen same-sex marriage legalised in the UK hastens the decline, then so be it.

They are running out of feet to shoot themselves in but, seemingly, they prefer extinction to change.   

[Walt Zingmatilder]

But the sexual orientation that informs the choice is - stop digging.

For the vast majority of human existence it seems that universally same sex marriage has not even been a thing. So that contention is dubious. There is the theory that humans are not naturally monogamous so that might make polygamy more innate than than same sex marriage. Does innate sexual orientation translate into the desire to marry. No, some people do not want to marry or believe in the institution vis the fight for the right for heterosexual civil partnership.

So your contention Gordon and Hillside is debateable.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Vlad,

I have no intention of not allowing the methodist church (of which I am also member by a quirk of
an ecumenical project) to conduct same sex marriages and I have no intention of schismatising with them although for the record, Trent I have thought about schismatising with the Cof E on attitudes toward current affairs.

I have no intention of not allowing the the non-racist bus company (in which I also own shares a by a quirk of company law) to let black passengers sit wherever they wish. I do though intend to keep right on with my own bus companies' racist practices.

Not a good argument is it? Or a good look.

You on the other hand seek the wholesale destruction of the church.

Flat out lying to get you out of the homophobic hole you've dug for yourself won't work, no matter how often you repeat the flat out lies.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Nope - as I said earlier in the thread, I'm happy to see the on-going slow disintegration of Christianity in the UK: and if removing privileges that allow them to be homophobic in opposition to the social changes that have seen same-sex marriage legalised in the UK hastens the decline, then so be it.

They are running out of feet to shoot themselves in but, seemingly, they prefer extinction to change.   

I was hoping some sadist would come up with the ''I want the church to die a slow and exquisitely painful death and I mean to turn homosexuality into that means of torture!''.........nice people.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Vlad,

For the vast majority of human existence it seems that universally same sex marriage has not even been a thing.

For the vast majority of human existence it seems that universally banning slavery has not even been a thing. So?
 

So that contention is dubious. There is the theory that humans are not naturally monogamous so that might make polygamy more innate than than same sex marriage. Does innate sexual orientation translate into the desire to marry. No, some people do not want to marry or believe in the institution vis the fight for the right for heterosexual civil partnership.

Irrelevant.

So your contention Gordon and Hillside is debateable.

If you think something is debatable then debate it rather than lie about it.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Vlad,

I was hoping some sadist would come up with the ''I want the church to die a slow and exquisitely painful death and I mean to turn homosexuality into that means of torture!''.........nice people.

Actually (and a I have always said and you have always lied about) what I would prefer is a church treated as a private members' club like any other able to make its case as it pleases so as to attract its members but without the trappings of the numerous special privileges afforded to it in the public square. 

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Vlad,

I have no intention of not allowing the the non-racist bus company (in which I also own shares a by a quirk of company law) to let black passengers sit wherever they wish. I do though intend to keep right on with my own bus companies' racist practices.

Not a good argument is it? Or a good look.

Flat out lying to get you out of the homophobic hole you've dug for yourself won't work, no matter how often you repeat the flat out lies.

Next you'll be attacking Pro Gender neutral methodists for sharing fellowship with Gender important methodists and after them athiest methodists for sharing fellowship with theist methodists.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Vlad,

Actually (and a I have always said and you have always lied about) what I would prefer is a church treated as a private members' club like any other able to make its case as it pleases so as to attract its members but without the trappings of the numerous special privileges afforded to it in the public square.

Which trappings are you talking about.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Vlad,

Next you'll be attacking Pro Gender neutral methodists for sharing fellowship with Gender important methodists and after them athiest methodists for sharing fellowship with theist methodists.

You seem to have hit the random word generator button.

I told you why your argument was wrong - address that or don't, but endless (and incoherent) diversions aren't helping you.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Vlad,

For the vast majority of human existence it seems that universally banning slavery has not even been a thing.

Not true.

[Gordon]

I was hoping some sadist would come up with the ''I want the church to die a slow and exquisitely painful death and I mean to turn homosexuality into that means of torture!''.........nice people.

If this 'church' is in the business of practicing homophobia then I'm happy to see the back of them - and I need do nothing to hasten their demise, since they are managing to slowly self-destruct without any help from me.   

[bluehillside Retd.]

Vlad,

Which trappings are you talking about.

The ones we've talked about endlessly on this mb - in education, in the legislature, in the media etc. Before you shoot off into yet another diversion, to try to keep you at least vaguely on topic try for starters the Equalities Act 2010 that gives special exemptions to religious institutions so they can perpetuate their homophobic practices.   

[bluehillside Retd.]

Vlad,

Not true.

True.