Methodists affirm gay marriage.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

I have friends who are gay and religious. In fact, as far as I am concerned an alarming number of gay people have this unfortunate side to their nature. Be that as it may, why are you promoting discrimination against religious gay people?

I could understand you calling me out for hypocrisy if I was arguing it for myself. I'm not. I actually don't give a toss for myself. The Church can continue on it's little pathetic discriminatory way if it were just me. It's not.

I'm arguing for it for the numerous gay people who seem to think they have a place within the Church, a Church that insists on treating them as second class in some aspects as reflected by your position on this matter.

There don't appear to be any gay Christians on this board. Trent. You have been too successful in your atheist mission perhaps.

[Anchorman]

Really - and there was me thinking that the services that the CofE provides are called 'Services' e.g. on your average Sunday or a wedding Service, Funeral Service etc.

[/quoteI just knew someone would make this foolish conflation

   


The term 'service' is nopt service to a congregation or a community in the context of worship, it is service to God.

[Nearly Sane]

There don't appear to be any gay Christians on this board. Trent. You have been too successful in your atheist mission perhaps.

perhaps your homophobia has had more effect.

[bluehillside Retd.]

VtH,

And what do you think that means?

It’s your claim, you tell us. From what I can make out though, you think it means that it’s the matrimony service that's extra special, super-duper, the one god really likes the most, laden with special significance type that your church will provide on a discriminatory basis to straight people but not to gay people, oh no Sirree.

It's like the 99 ice cream with a chocolate flake and extra sprinkles vs the plain cornet, only the bloke driving the Toni's ice cream van won't sell the 99 to the ginger kids.   

Is that it?

[ProfessorDavey]

   


The term 'service' is nopt service to a congregation or a community in the context of worship, it is service to God.

Irrelevant - the CofE is providing a service to their congregations and others - including wedding services.

If I go to a local hotel to talk to them about holding my wedding there I am asking them whether they will provide a service to me. If I go to a local CofE church to talk to them about holding my wedding there I am asking them whether they will provide a service to me. What they provide may be slightly different but in both cases they are offering a service to the public.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

perhaps your homophobia has had more effect.

Given the disproportion between the amount of posts by numerous atheists unsympathetic to Christia nity and me talking about gay marriage.....I support it, Holy same sex marriage...... I have no expertise or revelation on it, I would have to say no it probably isn't  my alleged homophobia.

[Nearly Sane]

Given the disproportion between the amount of posts by numerous atheists unsympathetic to Christia nity and me talking about gay marriage.....I support it, Holy same sex marriage...... I have no expertise or revelation on it, I would have to say no it probably isn't  my alleged homophobia.

You don't support gay marriage in your church which shows your homophobia.

[bluehillside Retd.]

VtH,

Given the disproportion between the amount of posts by numerous atheists unsympathetic to Christia nity and me talking about gay marriage.....I support it, Holy same sex marriage...... I have no expertise or revelation on it, I would have to say no it probably isn't  my alleged homophobia.

That’ll be your actual homophobia.

[Anchorman]

Irrelevant - the CofE is providing a service to their congregations and others - including wedding services. If I go to a local hotel to talk to them about holding my wedding there I am asking them whether they will provide a service to me. If I go to a local CofE church to talk to them about holding my wedding there I am asking them whether they will provide a service to me. What they provide may be slightly different but in both cases they are offering a service to the public.

A wedding service is a time of 'serving' God in worship during which an act of marriage takes place. The serivice is due to, and performed to, God, not the couple.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Anchs,

A wedding service is a time of 'serving' God in worship during which an act of marriage takes place. The serivice is due to, and performed to, God, not the couple.

If the officiating clergy think their “service is due to, and preformed to, God” as you put it why then care about whether the couple involved in the act of marriage part are straight or gay? 

[Walt Zingmatilder]

You don't support gay marriage in your church which shows your homophobia.

And that is the reason people of religion of any sexuality have abandoned these message boards populated by aggressive atheists how?

[bluehillside Retd.]

VtH,

And that is the reason people of religion of any sexuality have abandoned these message boards populated by aggressive atheists how?

What "aggression" do you think you've identified?

Given your endless evasions, dishonesties, disappearances etc I'm frankly surprised at how little aggression you receive - sheer bloody exasperation at your appalling behaviour maybe, but not aggression.   

[Nearly Sane]

And that is the reason people of religion of any sexuality have abandoned these message boards populated by aggressive atheists how?

You seem to be admitting your homophobia here, did you mean to do that?

[Walt Zingmatilder]

You seem to be admitting your homophobia here, did you mean to do that?

I think it's perfectly clear whether I am homophobic or not the migration of people of religion of whatever sexuality
is the responsibility of the aggressive atheist cabal who dominate this message board.....no names, no pack drill.

[bluehillside Retd.]

VtH,

I think it's perfectly clear whether I am homophobic or not…

Yes it is – you’ve told us that your god story, your church and you are all homophobic. Indeed, you seem to be proud of it.

…the migration of people of religion of whatever sexuality
is the responsibility of the aggressive atheist cabal who dominate this message board.....no names, no pack drill.

No truth either. I would imagine that decent people who actually are Christians would tear their hair out at the damage your behaviour here has done to their faith.   

[Walt Zingmatilder]

VtH,

Yes it is – you’ve told us that your god story, your church and you are all homophobic. Indeed, you seem to be proud of it.

No truth either. I would imagine that decent people who actually are Christians would tear their hair out at the damage your behaviour here has done to their faith.

It must be hard Hillside to be told that you have no demonstrable experience, expertise or empathy an a topic but I don't think turbo charged gas lighting is a convincing response.

Absolute gaslighting, Absolute heinousness, Absolute compliance to our will.

Ancient order of angry atheists.

[bluehillside Retd.]

VtH,

It must be hard Hillside to be told that you have no demonstrable experience, expertise or empathy an a topic but I don't think turbo charged gas lighting is a convincing response.

Absolute gaslighting, Absolute heinousness, Absolute compliance to our will.

Ancient order of angry atheists.

Did any of this mean something in your head when you typed it, or was it thrown together randomly by an algorithm of some sort?

More to the point though, does your god story's, your church's and your homophobia really not trouble you in the slightest?

Nothing at all?   

[Aruntraveller]

There don't appear to be any gay Christians on this board. Trent. You have been too successful in your atheist mission perhaps.

As the number of gay Christians on the board is not relevant I'm struggling to see how you think that this is a useful statement.

As to my atheist mission....have you been watching too many Tom Cruise films, perhaps?

I don't get up in the morning and plan my day around how I can heinously upset you. I respond to whatever is posted. No mission. Not even much of an agenda, just trying to point out that you sound just a little bit prejudiced on this subject.

To be clear (as you seem to have problems with understanding nuance within a subject) that's not the same as somebody who beats a gay person to death, or harasses them on the street, or even posts I've see by others on here in the past.

You just sound a little bit prejudiced is all. 

Now I think about myself and my attitude to religious people. Do I campaign to stop them going to Church? No. Do I campaign to stop them marrying in Church? No. Do I do anything to stop them following their religion? No. The only thing I ask is that religious people drop the prejudice they hold against gay people who are religious and give them the same respect as other people in the Church.

Is that understandable as an explanation of my position?

[bluehillside Retd.]

Trent,

Is that understandable as an explanation of my position?

Very – his standard procedure though will be to wait a bit, then tell you that you’ve said something entirely different, then demand that you defend his entirely different version.

He’s got form. 

(Either that or yet another deflection.)

[Outrider]

Yes, Discrimination against.

Homophobia is, amongst other things, discrimination against gay people based upon their sexuality, like you are defending religious institutions doing.

You see where this is leading, right?

O.

[Roses]

Vlad wears rose coloured specs where homophobic religious institutions are concerned.

[Spud]

Apart from showing your utter ignorance about homophobia which others have already corrected you on, the idea that my gay friends who I visited in hospital after they were beaten up for being gay were playing the victim is a joke. Your ignorance and vapid ill thought out homophobia in part supports those thugs that beat my friends up. It pisses on any idea that Jesus may have talked about loving other people. It twists the spear in his side. It pushes the crown of thorns deeper onto his head. It adds a further 39 scourges.

You can love a gay person without condoning what they do.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Roses,

Vlad wears rose coloured specs where homophobic religious institutions are concerned. 

There’s no telling what goes on in hall of mirrors that is Vlad’s mind, but for what it’s worth I don’t get the sense that he’s inherently a homophobe who’s cast around for biblical support for his prejudice (though there are plenty of those too). On the other hand, he seems to have convinced himself that certain things are inerrantly true for very bad reasons, and one of those things is a homophobic god and a homophobic church.

He can’t square that particular circle, so instead he’s tried ever more desperate (and dishonest) tactics – re-defining the word, straw men, various fallacies, collapse into gibberish etc – as attempts at deflecting from the problem.

It’s easy when you’re not part of that personal hell to say, “just be honest then” but when honesty requires the rejection of deep emotional investment perhaps it’s not that easy to do. Chalk it up as another example of religious faith screwing up a moral compass perhaps?     

[Nearly Sane]

You can love a gay person without condoning what they do.

Yeah, treating people as inferior is so about the love. There were Christians that used that approach to slavery.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Spud,

You can love a gay person without condoning what they do.

Ah, the old “hate the sin, love the sinner” perniciousness beloved of many a Christian.

First, it’s not your position to “condone” what gay people “do”, any more than it’s their position to condone what you do. What other people do in bed is none of your business. Try to understand that.

Second, if you “love” someone why would you also deny them rights and services? Surely you’d be concerned to ensure they enjoy equality with everyone else wouldn’t you?