Should he stay or should he go?

[Aruntraveller]

John Crace takes aim - albeit the target is so easy to hit it is impossible to miss.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jan/18/even-under-the-mask-johnson-looked-like-someone-who-knew-the-game-was-up

Thanks for highlighting that I'd missed it. The comments were very entertaining, and threw up some Yeats as an extra treat:

“Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the center cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world.”

[Aruntraveller]

According to the political editor of The Times, Steven Swinford -  a cabinet member said this of their red wall MP's:

'It's pretty sickening. They were only elected because of him. Most of them are a load of fucking nobodies. It's nuts'

As a policy to win friends and influence people I'm not sure calling them "fucking nobodies" will be effective, and that's ignoring the inherent irony in the statement.

[SteveH]

John Crace takes aim - albeit the target is so easy to hit it is impossible to miss.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jan/18/even-under-the-mask-johnson-looked-like-someone-who-knew-the-game-was-up

Not the best-written piece by Crace that I've ever read: the "things fall apart" at the beginning of nearly every paragraph rapidly gets tiresome, and I don't think bloodshot pupils are possible: it's the whites of eyes that get bloodshot.
My Tory MP, Mike Penning, has claimed to be "furious" with Johnson, but, while it may be cynical of me, I suspect his fury is manufactured in his own interest, because he's betting on Johnson leaving in disgrace soon, and wants to ingratiate himself with whoever succeeds him. H'e not noted for taking principled stands contrary to his own interests.

[Nearly Sane]

Not the best-written piece by Crace that I've ever read: the "things fall apart" at the beginning of nearly every paragraph rapidly gets tiresome, and I don't think bloodshot pupils are possible: it's the whites of eyes that get bloodshot.
My Tory MP, Mike Penning, has claimed to be "furious" with Johnson, but, while it may be cynical of me, I suspect his fury is manufactured in his own interest, because he's betting on Johnson leaving in disgrace soon, and wants to ingratiate himself with whoever succeeds him. H'e not noted for taking principled stands contrary to his own interests.

As I have seen pointed out elsewhere the Tory Party survives by getting rid of unpopular leaders, Johnson more than most depends on popularity, since he isn't an ideologue.  think Mike Penning is thinking more about voters rather than the next leader since unless they are from outside the cabinet (Jeremy Hunt?), they are still effectively Johnson supporters. It's noticeable how carefully Sunak's support for him has been phrased

[Nearly Sane]

Tory MP crosses the floor to Labour

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60054968

[Aruntraveller]

Tory MP crosses the floor to Labour

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60054968

Interesting. Although whether this is motivated by concern for his constituents or his own self-interest is open to interpretation. Or it could be both, happily for him.

[Nearly Sane]

Interesting. Although whether this is motivated by concern for his constituents or his own self-interest is open to interpretation. Or it could be both, happily for him.

I suspect if he was really wanting something for his constituents, he should resign his set and stand for the Labour party in the by election on an 'the parties are over' approach for Boris. But I doubt he will.

[Nearly Sane]

The rise in inflation is very worrying. Note the RPI which is the index that used to be used is at 7.5%.  Anyone that might be thinking of challenging Johnson will be concerned about the impact of this, rising interest rates, the breaking of the triple-lock on pensions. and how all that would play in the May elections.

[The Accountant, OBE, KC]

VG and TV

Very interesting posts.

Susan - I was watching PMQ today and Johnson is acting like a schoolboy laughing and making faces as he is being questioned on misleading Parliament and his weak excuses and insincere apologies for holding boozy parties in 10 Downing Street.

Former Cabinet minister and Tory MP David Davies just asked Johnson to go. I think such steps away from the usual blind unthinking political support for their leader is an important step forward. Especially when their leader is smirking and laughing in the House of Commons, at the voting British public.

Many Tory supporters will probably continue to put their blind faith in the concept of Boris the brand as the leader of their country as it can be frightening to lose your beliefs / world view by thinking more critically based on the evidence. Many may prefer to hide their head in wishful thinking and daydreams of a principled Tory leadership, and ignoring the evidence of corruption, mismanagement and incompetence, such as the Boris the Buffoon brand claiming he did not know parties at work were against the rules. 

Clearly, he has been advised to keep talking about Brexit, the economy, the vaccine programme on the basis that these will sufficiently compensate for a leader's lack of moral integrity. Does it remind you of something - this faith and belief in an intangible brand that allows you to overlook the bad stuff and focus on the good?

[SteveH]

I suspect if he was really wanting something for his constituents, he should resign his set and stand for the Labour party in the by election on an 'the parties are over' approach for Boris. But I doubt he will.

He'd have to be selected by the Labour party first, and they would probably select the previous Labour candidate, Lucy Burke.

[Anchorman]

Comment from Paul Kavanagh. https://weegingerdug.wordpress.com/2022/01/19/johnsons-tears-are-only-for-himself/

[Nearly Sane]

He'd have to be selected by the Labour party first, and they would probably select the previous Labour candidate, Lucy Burke.

Which doesn't really give him an incentive to resign

[SusanDoris]

I just wrote and posted a reply to Ga briella - but it's not here. Here it is again

Susan - I was watching PMQ today and Johnson is acting like a schoolboy laughing and making faces as he is being questioned on misleading Parliament and his weak excuses and insincere apologies for holding boozy parties in 10 Downing Street.

I never listen to PMQs, but today I did! I did wonder what Boris looked like!! I think that was foolish of him to make faces etc, however the words are, I think, the most likely to carry him through.

Former Cabinet minister and Tory MP David Davies just asked Johnson to go. I think such steps away from the usual blind unthinking political support for their leader is an important step forward. Especially when their leader is smirking and laughing in the House of Commons, at the voting British public.

Having heard and seen David Davies in person, - I think it was when he wanted to be PM himself, I did not like his approach. In my opinion, he is bitter because he wasn’t elected by Conservatives to be their leader and is still carrying that bitterness instead of letting it go and moving on.

Many Tory supporters will probably continue to put their blind faith in the concept of Boris the brand as the leader of their country as it can be frightening to lose your beliefs / world view by thinking more critically based on the evidence.

For me, my support is not blind, it is practical and having considered carefully what the alternatives are both locally, nationally and internationally.

Many prefer to hide their head in wishful thinking and daydreams of a principled Tory leadership, and ignoring the evidence of corruption, mismanagement and incompetence, such as the Boris the Buffoon brand claiming he did not know parties at work were against the rules. 

Okay, but as I have said quite a few times hereabouts, who exactly would you have to take his place, how would this be done quickly an legally andalso supposing the person you think would be good, it turned out to be someone else entirely?!

Clearly, he has been advised to keep talking about Brexit, the economy, the vaccine programme on the basis that these will sufficiently compensate for a leader's lack of moral integrity. Does it remind you of something - this faith and belief in an intangible brand that allows you to overlook the bad stuff and focus on the good?

Unfortunately, it is too often what happens.

[The Accountant, OBE, KC]

I just wrote and posted a reply to Ga briella - but it's not here. Here it is again
I never listen to PMQs, but today I did! I did wonder what Boris looked like!! I think that was foolish of him to make faces etc, however the words are, I think, the most likely to carry him through. Having heard and seen David Davies in person, - I think it was when he wanted to be PM himself, I did not like his approach. In my opinion, he is bitter because he wasn’t elected by Conservatives to be their leader and is still carrying that bitterness instead of letting it go and moving on.For me, my support is not blind, it is practical and having considered carefully what the alternatives are both locally, nationally and internationally.Okay, but as I have said quite a few times hereabouts, who exactly would you have to take his place, how would this be done quickly an legally andalso supposing the person you think would be good, it turned out to be someone else entirely?!Unfortunately, it is too often what happens.

I think it's important for accountability as well as credible leadership that the Prime Minister doesn't keep getting caught out blatantly breaking national regulations and following that up by looking like a foolish schoolboy mocking questions at PMQ by smirking and making faces and rolling his eyes.

So at this point if he steps down as leader in order for the Tories to not be seen as a joke, they could probably put Sunak or Javid in his place - they at least seem to know how to conduct themselves in a less buffoon-like manner. They both seem to act like professionals rather than tabloid journalists boozing it up at a party with the boys. Hopefully the novelty has worn off among Tory voters with Johnson's over-grown school-boy, hand caught in the cookie-jar style antics.

Johnson was elected leader before Covid-19 and he has spent a lot of the pandemic treating serious decisions with life or death consequences for ordinary people as a joke. It's time for him to go.

Hopefully the Tories won't replace Johnson with a Z-list celebrity reality star but with the Tories you never know.

[Nearly Sane]

Blackmail? Colour me unsurprised.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60068612

[Gordon]

Rory Stewart's take on Boris the Liar (from Guardian Live blog).

Boris Johnson is a terrible prime minister and a worse human being.

But he is not a monster newly sprung from a rent between this world and the next. Twenty years have passed since the Conservative party first selected him as a candidate. Michael Howard and David Cameron made him a shadow minister, and Theresa May gave him the Foreign Office. Thirty years of celebrity made him famous for his mendacity, indifference to detail, poor administration, and inveterate betrayal of every personal commitment.

Yet, knowing this, the majority of Conservative MPs, and party members, still voted for him to be prime minister. He is not, therefore, an aberration, but a product of a system that will continue to produce terrible politicians long after he is gone.

MPs selected him because they would not risk the possibility of a smaller majority under a better leader. Winning mattered more than governing well. And the public often seems to share this indifference

[Nearly Sane]

Rishi Sunak knifing him from the front


https://archive.vn/xQzQu

[Sebastian Toe]

 

[jeremyp]

He's been caught lying again.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60143279

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Johnson was piss poor today. Why he thinks repeating the same questionable bollocks about covid response and economic response is what we want to here rather than the game of Tipping Point he finds himself in. I don't know.
The British people surely want to see this cockwomble try to cling on, have his political fingers politically stepped on and then fall of a cliff.

[SusanDoris]

He's been caught lying again.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60143279

'...it has been suggested...'
Thirdperson report ...

I'm not excusing him but the words do not appear to come direct and recorded by him.

[Aruntraveller]

Not exactly a third person report when it is government e-mails saying that the PM took the decision, although heavily redacted. It is clear that permission was given by the PM. Or somebody got it wrong. Which is more likely I wonder.

https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/43225/html/

SD I do wonder if you will ever own up to the Conservative Party having chosen a wrong 'un.

[Harrowby Hall]

My impression has always been that Alexander Johnson wants to have been Prime Minister rather wants to be Prime Minister.

It is the least damaging way to transition between these two states that is beyond his comprehension.

[SusanDoris]

Not exactly a third person report when it is government e-mails saying that the PM took the decision, although heavily redacted. It is clear that permission was given by the PM. Or somebody got it wrong. Which is more likely I wonder.

https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/43225/html/

SD I do wonder if you will ever own up to the Conservative Party having chosen a wrong 'un.

The PM  did not actually send the e-mail himself. As I have said quite a few times, I did not vote for Boris, but he's the leader we've got and I cannot change that ... ... and my other question remains! Who would you, who in fact could you, have right now?

[Aruntraveller]

The PM  did not actually send the e-mail himself. As I have said quite a few times, I did not vote for Boris, but he's the leader we've got and I cannot change that ... ... and my other question remains! Who would you, who in fact could you, have right now?

I know you didn't vote for him in the ballot, but you voted for him at the GE (I know you'll now play semantics and say you voted for your local MP but it was, in the end, Johnson you voted for) and given his track record up until that point which was well documented by many and observable by the rest of us, it was entirely predictable we would end up here. The point is there are some in the Tory party who would be more suited to the job - none, save perhaps Sunak, who are in the cabinet, unfortunately. He wouldn't be my choice, but then as I'm sure you realise by now I wouldn't choose any Tory.

Perhaps we should go with Rees Mogg's suggestion and have a General Election. He was talking sense for once, even if it was only said to scare the Tory backbenchers into compliance.