Holy Grail

[Sriram]

Hi everyone,

A nice video on the Holy grail...

https://www.bbc.com/reel/video/p0bt6xl5/is-this-the-home-of-the-holy-grail-

Cheers.

Sriram Rao

[Spud]

I think we've already got one!

[Dicky Underpants]

I think we've already got one!

I'd rather have a shrubbery.

[Enki]

I think you'll find it at the Holy Grail counter in Harrods, unless it's gone missing again.

[Udayana]

I think you'll find it at the Holy Grail counter in Harrods, unless it's gone missing again.

I expect they have a selection. Make sure to choose wisely

[Dicky Underpants]

I think you'll find it at the Holy Grail counter in Harrods, unless it's gone missing again.

But I don't think the shrubberies would be very cheap there.

[Dicky Underpants]

Hi everyone,

A nice video on the Holy grail...

https://www.bbc.com/reel/video/p0bt6xl5/is-this-the-home-of-the-holy-grail-

Cheers.

Sriram Rao

Quite possibly the Valencia cup is a Hebrew vessel 2000 years old. More than that can't be said. The video's presenter refers to "the shift from religion to literature about the Grail". This is rubbish. The inventor of the story was Chretien de Troyes in the early Middle Ages, who doesn't call the vessel in Perceval's adventures 'holy' nor does he relate it to either the cup used at the Last Supper, nor the vessel supposedly used to collect Christ's blood during the Crucifixion - these are legends which came later, which somehow manage to conflate both receptacles into one. Unfortunately a lot of arse-gravy on the theme in our own times has been excreted by such overly-imaginative hacks as Baigent and Leigh. The theme always seems to be a good money spinner, so I don't suppose it's likely to disappear overnight. Unless the Russians bomb Valencia.

[Harrowby Hall]

To the best of my recollection, Professor Jones and his father left it in the Treasury at Petra where it was being well cared for.

[Anchorman]

Given the turbulent events of the three decades following the Resurrection, I think the Jesus movement had more important things to do than preserve Passover utensils (or any other 'relics', come to that.)
Apologiers to those armed with a spade (or set square and compass) hell bent on digging up a certain chapel in Central Scotland....)

[Dicky Underpants]

To the best of my recollection, Professor Jones and his father left it in the Treasury at Petra where it was being well cared for.

My word, it's moved around a lot - first in Monserrat, Catalunia, where the mediaeval chroniclers, then Wagner, then the Nazis insisted it was. Thereafter it seems to have been located in three places at once - Monserrat, but also the Basilica of San Isidoro in Leon, Spain, and Valencia too , as above. But it's holy, you see, so maybe all these things are possible.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Apparently it has fallen into atheist hands. AC Grailing.

[jeremyp]

Hi everyone,

A nice video on the Holy grail...

https://www.bbc.com/reel/video/p0bt6xl5/is-this-the-home-of-the-holy-grail-

Cheers.

Sriram Rao

Very interesting, but the point that Indiana Jones made in The Last Crusade is valid. The cups used at the Last Supper would almost certainly not have been fine artistry. Most likely it was standard pottery. Furthermore, unless one of the disciples nicked it, the Holy Grail would have been washed up and used for the second sitting.

[Anchorman]

Very interesting, but the point that Indiana Jones made in The Last Crusade is valid. The cups used at the Last Supper would almost certainly not have been fine artistry. Most likely it was standard pottery. Furthermore, unless one of the disciples nicked it, the Holy Grail would have been washed up and used for the second sitting.

   





If the NT is correct, the Last Supper took place in a room vorrowed from a relatively rich person - possibly a religious sympathiser.
The Passover utensils were - and still are - set aside specifically for that purpose and must have belonged to the house owner.
I agree that they would not have been elaborate, and had to have  been plain, though. The only decoration at the table would have been the menorah.
All the pascal utensils would have been set aside, and not used for any non-religious feast, being retained as family heirlooms and, therefore, used after Jesus' time, presumably being dispersed or destroyed at the fall of Jerusalem.

[Udayana]

 " if the NT is correct " => anything !

[jeremyp]

" if the NT is correct " => anything !

I think there's an implicit assumption that there was a Last Supper as described in the New Testament in the thread. I haven't checked yet to make sure all of the accounts are consistent in their description of the tableware though.

Anchorman is probably right but he's forgotten that the Last Supper was not the Passover meal in John's gospel.

[Dicky Underpants]

Anchorman is probably right but he's forgotten that the Last Supper was not the Passover meal in John's gospel.

Right about the John's gospel detail. But had Anchorman forgotten it?

[Anchorman]

I think there's an implicit assumption that there was a Last Supper as described in the New Testament in the thread. I haven't checked yet to make sure all of the accounts are consistent in their description of the tableware though.

Anchorman is probably right but he's forgotten that the Last Supper was not the Passover meal in John's gospel.

   



No; The Passover itself would have been on the Friday night as a magnified pre-Sabbath feast, however the week leading up to the big day was also celebrated in various festal meals, according to Gammaliel and Josephus. Presumably it was one of these which was the scene for the 'Last Suppper'. Only after the destruction of Jerusalem did the Passover become a 'slimmed down' three or four day meal.