What do atheists do when it comes to singing the national anthem?

[ProfessorDavey]

Jerusalem was used at the Commonwealth Games, so England have their own, and NI have Danny Boy then - though GSTK at football.

Hmm - I think you know my views about the Commonwealth games and more of that below.

I was thinking more about singing the anthem before a match involving international sides - so the England football and rugby sides don't sing Jerusalem, although I was at the ashes and it was sung there. 

What do you suggest gets played at the Olympics in place of GSTK?

I know this is a bit ducking the question, but I don't think the Olympics (nor the Commonwealth games) should be contested on the basis of countries as most (albeit not all) of the sports are individual. So Usain Bolt is fundamentally competing as Usain Bolt, not as 'Jamaica'. That would only really make sense if there was only one competitor representing each country, but that isn't the case.

So I'd do away with flags and anthems at the Olympics as I don't really understand why Andy Murray wins Wimbledon as Andy Murray (no national anthem played) so why doesn't he just win the Olympics as Andy Murray.

[Nearly Sane]

Hmm - I think you know my views about the Commonwealth games and more of that below.

I was thinking more about singing the anthem before a match involving international sides - so the England football and rugby sides don't sing Jerusalem, although I was at the ashes and it was sung there. 
I know this is a bit ducking the question, but I don't think the Olympics (nor the Commonwealth games) should be contested on the basis of countries as most (albeit not all) of the sports are individual. So Usain Bolt is fundamentally competing as Usain Bolt, not as 'Jamaica'. That would only really make sense if there was only one competitor representing each country, but that isn't the case.

So I'd do away with flags and anthems at the Olympics as I don't really understand why Andy Murray wins Wimbledon as Andy Murray (no national anthem played) so why doesn't he just win the Olympics as Andy Murray.

You seem to be taking about the differences between team sports and individual sports? What do you do about team sports at the Olympics? And do you really think the Olympics os feasible for the vast majority of sports and atheletes without the backing of their nations?

All of this is essentially a side issue to the question in the OP, and the use of GSTK as the national anthem of the UK.

[jeremyp]

I hate to be the one who breaks this to you, Hillside....but “Puff the magic dragon” isn’t actually about Dragons.

Yes it is.

[ProfessorDavey]

You seem to be taking about the differences between team sports and individual sports? What do you do about team sports at the Olympics? And do you really think the Olympics os feasible for the vast majority of sports and atheletes without the backing of their nations?

Well I also think that the Olympics should only include sports where it is demonstrably the case that winning would represent the or a pinnacle of the career in comparison with other events.

So without doubt winning 100m Olympic gold has to be the best a sprinter could ever hope for. But in many (but perhaps not all) team sports this isn't the case. Do you really think that Harry Kane would consider winning a football Olympic gold as equivalent to the world cup - of course not. So sports that don't meet that criterion should not (in my opinion) be in the Olympics in the first place. So that would slim down the whole event which I see as a good thing anyhow, but would also disproportionately remove team sports I would imagine.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Yes it is.

I’m sorry Jeremy but it’s the inclusion of “little Jackie paper” that swings it for me.

[Outrider]

I’m sorry Jeremy but it’s the inclusion of “little Jackie paper” that swings it for me.

Whereas it's the explicit, continuous statements by the person that wrote it that swings it for me.

Wikipedia article for Puff the Magic Dragon

O.

[bluehillside Retd.]

Vlad,

I hate to be the one who breaks this to you, Hillside....but “Puff the magic dragon” isn’t actually about Dragons.

1. Yes it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9jfM7zV__g

2. Actually it’s more “about” the loss of innocence. Have a look at the lyrics.

3. I hate to be the one who breaks this to you Vlad....but the National Anthem isn’t actually “about” god either. 

[Sebastian Toe]

Whereas it's the explicit, continuous statements by the person that wrote it that swings it for me.

Wikipedia article for Puff the Magic Dragon

O.

I like the quote from the article "sloppy research".
Could that refer to one commenter here I wonder?

[SqueakyVoice]

So would you sing it if you were a monarchist?

IIRC, Brian Moore said he was a Republican and he sang GSTK as loud as he could to annoy the French.

[Gordon]

Putting 'God' to one side - I don't want to 'save' the monarch: I want to see the monarchy gone, at the earliest available opportunity.

[jeremyp]

I’m sorry Jeremy but it’s the inclusion of “little Jackie paper” that swings it for me.

From Wikipedia

The authors of the song have repeatedly rejected this interpretation [that it is about drugs] and have strongly and consistently denied that they intended any references to drug use. Both Lipton and Yarrow have stated, "'Puff, the Magic Dragon' is not about drugs.

[ProfessorDavey]

Putting 'God' to one side - I don't want to 'save' the monarch: I want to see the monarchy gone, at the earliest available opportunity.

Are there any other national anthems which involve, effectively, a pledge of allegiance to the head of state, rather than bigging up/pledging allegiance to the country and its people.

Genuine question.

[Nearly Sane]

Are there any other national anthems which involve, effectively, a pledge of allegiance to the head of state, rather than bigging up/pledging allegiance to the country and its people.

Genuine question.

On a very quick skim of the firsr part of the list, Brunei, Japan, and Jordan


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_national_anthems

[Dicky Underpants]

Well?

I'm English, and only sing the Welsh one.

(Unlike John Redwood)

[SqueakyVoice]

IIRC, Brian Moore said he was a Republican and he sang GSTK as loud as he could to annoy the French.

I suppose the lyrics could be changed to,
"Pay tax you greedy King...", 
but I doubt many people would accept that.

[SteveH]

I don't know what atheists would do, but I as a republican would stand still (I wouldn't remain seated - that would be childish petulance) and remain silent.

[Gordon]

I'd just completely ignore it - although I don't think I've come across it being played in public in recent years, and I don't attend or generally even watch sports events where anthems are commonly played. I suppose I'm being deprived of opportunities to demonstrably ignore it. 

In any event as far as I know, so my grandson tells me, when Scotland are playing football or rugby the UK national anthem isn't the anthem that is used to represent Scotland.

[jeremyp]

Are there any other national anthems which involve, effectively, a pledge of allegiance to the head of state, rather than bigging up/pledging allegiance to the country and its people.

Genuine question.

The British national anthem doesn't include a pledge of allegiance to either the King or the state.

[SteveH]

If we scrapped 'God Save Our Gracious Quing', what should replace it? My vote goes to 'I Vow To Thee, My Country'.

[jeremyp]

If we scrapped 'God Save Our Gracious Quing', what should replace it? My vote goes to 'I Vow To Thee, My Country'.

Well it's a better tune but it does include a pledge of allegiance.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Why have one with words?
What about a quick version of Stewart Lee’s “Ricky Gervais saying the unsayable”?

[Nearly Sane]

If we scrapped 'God Save Our Gracious Quing', what should replace it? My vote goes to 'I Vow To Thee, My Country'.

Surely the Archers

https://youtu.be/i9nnnM-__JQ?si=eeIxh22nLDEKukdM

[Sebastian Toe]

Why have one with words?
What about a quick version of Stewart Lee’s “Ricky Gervais saying the unsayable”?

I don't know that one, how does it go?

[Harrowby Hall]

If we scrapped 'God Save Our Gracious Quing', what should replace it? My vote goes to 'I Vow To Thee, My Country'.

Serious suggestion -  Song for a Festival Music composed by George Dyson, words by Cecil Day Lewis.

Written, I believe, for the Festival of Britain in 1951.

Brave isle of meadow cliff and cloud
.

[SteveH]

Just stand quietly, presumably. That's what I do, as a republican. I also decline to sing 'Onward Christian Soldiers', as a Christian(ish) pacifist(ish).