Professor Rosaria Butterfield gives a powerful and brave speech to students.

[ProfessorDavey]

You will never personally understand our motivation until you have experienced God's unconditional love yourself - then you will want others to share it, because God's love motivates us to will the ultimate good of others.

Patronising self-aggrandisement.

[bluehillside Retd.]

AB,

At the time I posted it I was not aware of her name and title.

After discovering her name in the small print I thought it more informative to offer her true identity if anyone wished to follow it up (as Bluehillside did).

It brought a predictable reaction from many on this forum, but I felt compelled to share it as a witness to the life God wants us to follow as opposed to the self centred lifestyles based on worldly values which lead us away from God's unconditional love.

You think your god wants us to lead a life of bigotry and intolerance toward some of His creation because of the nature He arranged for them to be born into?

I sometimes wonder whether if anyone ever produced any evidence for this supposed god such that I’d be forced to be a theist I wouldn’t also be an anti-theist – ie, “god exists, but what a morally bankrupt piece of shit He is”.   

[bluehillside Retd.]

AB,

It is not easy being a Christian witness in this increasing secular society.

Cry me a river. Presumably what you actually mean here is something like “It is not easy being a Christian in this increasingly secular society that denies me the special privileges and rights I wish to arrogate to myself and to my blind faith beliefs”.

Does it really not occur to you that if you didn’t try to impose your unpleasant idiocies on others, then the secular society that actually protects your right to believe and to speak about those idiocies would have no interest in you at all?

You will never personally understand our motivation until you have experienced God's unconditional love yourself - then you will want others to share it, because God's love motivates us to will the ultimate good of others.

And you it seems will never understand that, until you can give those with whom you would share your beliefs some sound reasons to think you’re right, then they have every reason to tell you to keep your unpleasant nonsense to yourself.

[jeremyp]

It brought a predictable reaction from many on this forum, but I felt compelled to share it as a witness to the life God wants us to follow as opposed to the self centred lifestyles based on worldly values which lead us away from God's unconditional love.

What is more self centred than denying gay people the right to marry the person they love just because you don't like it?

[jeremyp]

It is not easy being a Christian witness in this increasing secular society.

It is a lot easier than it was being a Christian witness when Nero was looking for somebody to blame for the Great Fire of Rome.

Or being a Jewish witness in Christian England in the Middle Ages. Or being a Protestant witness in the reign of Bloody Mary, or a Catholic witness for a couple of centuries afterwards.

All you have to put up with is a bit of push back on internet forums. People with the wrong beliefs in theocracies frequently meet very sticky ends.

You will never personally understand our motivation until you have experienced God's unconditional love yourself - then you will want others to share it, because God's love motivates us to will the ultimate good of others.

I'm an ex-Christian. But I came to understand that my faith was intellectually bankrupt.

[jeremyp]

Is it a 'free will' choice though?

Ha ha. Let's not go there.

[Outrider]

It is not easy being a Christian witness in this increasing secular society.

Because people tell you that you're wrong, and sometimes that you're discriminatory. I'll take that over the previous where it wasn't easy being gay because you were criminalised and ostracised by society.

You will never personally understand our motivation until you have experienced God's unconditional love yourself - then you will want others to share it, because God's love motivates us to will the ultimate good of others.

I can understand, I don't appreciate, perhaps. Similarly, I understand schizophrenic episodes without appreciating them.

O.

[ProfessorDavey]

Is it a 'free will' choice though?

Not heading down that rabbit hole NS.

[Enki]

Dear Rosaria,
I know that you would probably resent or ignore this, but, nevertheless, I feel that perhaps you or your supporters may benefit from this advice.

In response to your video may I suggest that you try to show a little generosity of attitude towards people who just want to live their lives as they choose  within a Christian framework and without harming others. I realise you are basically talking to other Christians, but, instead of trying to divide, wouldn't it be better to show humility before your God by showing respect towards others, even if you disagree with them. After all, they look upon themselves as truly Christian also.
Perhaps it would give you a genuine feeling of accomplishment if you tried to respect other people's sexual differences and showed a charitable approach towards them, rather than labelling them and their practices as sinful. Your whole approach doesn't really show you in a particularly good light, does it as you tend to come across as an extremely bigoted and harsh individual who has decided that your way is the only way for Christians?

[Enki]

Not heading down that rabbit hole NS.

If AB is correct about his free will being linked to his soul, then, on the basis of his support for this video, I would suggest that the location of his soul can be deduced as being somewhere in his nether regions, found by putting the letters 'AR' in front. 

[Walt Zingmatilder]

AB,

Cry me a river. Presumably what you actually mean here is something like “It is not easy being a Christian in this increasingly secular society that denies me the special privileges and rights I wish to arrogate to myself and to my blind faith beliefs”.

Does it really not occur to you that if you didn’t try to impose your unpleasant idiocies on others, then the secular society that actually protects your right to believe and to speak about those idiocies would have no interest in you at all?

Sounds like https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savior_complex https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_savior

[Alan Burns]

What is more self centred than denying gay people the right to marry the person they love just because you don't like it?

This is not about personal preferences.
My concern is the eternal salvation of our human souls.

[Nearly Sane]

This is not about personal preferences.
My concern is the eternal salvation of our human souls.

Because you worship a god that punishes people for loving each other. There are people of your faith who have touted that 'muscegenation' was evil for the same reasons. Just as they were/are racist, you are a homophobe.

[Gordon]

This is not about personal preferences.
My concern is the eternal salvation of our human souls.

Then you are seriously misguided: a concern that people are valued and respected as individuals, and are not discriminated against based on the prejudices of others, would be a far greater value than your adherence to homophobic superstitions.   

[Alan Burns]

Because you worship a god that punishes people for loving each other. There are people of your faith who have touted that 'muscegenation' was evil for the same reasons. Just as they were/are racist, you are a homophobe.

There is no biblical justification for miscegenation

[jeremyp]

This is not about personal preferences.

Yes it is. Your personal preference is to interfere with other people's lives.

My concern is the eternal salvation of our human souls.

Concern yourself with the salvation of your own soul and let other people live their lives according to their conscience.

This is the problem I have with Christians like you. It's not that I think your beliefs are delusory (I do, but it's OK to disagree) but that you seek to make other people miserable as a consequence of your beliefs and yet you can't offer a shred of evidence for your "faith". They are not hurting you. Leave them alone.

[Nearly Sane]

There is no biblical justification for miscegenation

Other Christians would disagree. And since there is a biblical justification for rape and murder as well...

[jeremyp]

There is no biblical justification for miscegenation

Who gives a flying fuck about what people two to two and a half thousand years ago wrote. The biblical justification of slavery should be all you need to know that the Bible is not to be trusted on matters of morality.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Who gives a flying fuck about what people two to two and a half thousand years ago wrote. The biblical justification of slavery should be all you need to know that the Bible is not to be trusted on matters of morality.

Fallacy of modernity and genetic fallacy as well from this poster.
[/quote]

[Nearly Sane]

Fallacy of modernity and genetic fallacy as well from this poster.

You seem happy with slavery and homophobia
 

[Alan Burns]

Who gives a flying fuck about what people two to two and a half thousand years ago wrote. The biblical justification of slavery should be all you need to know that the Bible is not to be trusted on matters of morality.

The morality upon which our western civilisation was built derives from the teachings of the Christian Bible.

[bluehillside Retd.]

AB,

The morality upon which our western civilisation was built derives from the teachings of the Christian Bible.

Depends what you mean by “derives from” but in any case, so what? “…the teachings of the Christian Bible” contain all manner of morally depraved injunctions and instructions that “Western civilisation(s)” have long since rejected. What makes you think that the homophobic parts in particular should be preserved in aspic for this purpose? 

[Outrider]

Fallacy of modernity and genetic fallacy as well from this poster.

Nope and nope. Try again.

O.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

AB,

Depends what you mean by “derives from” but in any case, so what? “…the teachings of the Christian Bible” contain all manner of morally depraved injunctions and instructions that “Western civilisation(s)” have long since rejected. What makes you think that the homophobic parts in particular should be preserved in aspic for this purpose?

Evwee day, in evwee way we're getting better and better.

[jeremyp]

Fallacy of modernity and genetic fallacy as well from this poster.

Alan wants to judge our actions and behaviour by the moral standards of ancient people - people who endorsed slavery. Excuse me for not putting much value in Biblical morality.