SNP. Why Are They Thriving?

[King Oberon]

Are you in favour of staying in the EU? I can't be bothered checking all your posts also I can't remember if we are better together or not 

I noticed one of your posts saying that the SNP would give 'rise' to English Nationalism, I would be amused if I thought you were serious!

English Nationalism has always been there, they used to in a minority... I can only hope they still are since we are still joined at the hip. I guess with the EU referendum we will find out 

[jakswan]

Are you in favour of staying in the EU? I can't be bothered checking all your posts also I can't remember if we are better together or not 

Out, its a sure fire way to shut the toxic SNP up. Mind have to credit Tories for saying they will give tax raising powers to Scotland early, puts them on the spot! I doubt the Tories will push too hard though after all the SNP have put a good few nails in Labour's coffin.

How about you I'm assuming you would agree with an out vote? Your argument would maybe run something like this:-

I think we are better out at least we could vote politicans in or out rather than just have to accept whoever mainland Europe vote in (for themselves).

The problem with EU politics is that it's institutionalised and that's were the corruption comes from. Germany and France (and those other ones) have to many old school boy networks and to many ties with business to be otherwise.

I think it would take a good few centuries for and Independent UK to get to that stage. Not only that but at least we would have a chance to try and get it right which unless there is a miracle will never happen in Brussels.

[King Oberon]

Toxic SNP.. really Jak, obsessed much?? 

I would have thought a 'better together' boy would be voting in, Farage get to you did he?

I would assume your argument would be along the lines of long live little england, let's get rid of johnny foreigner (aka anyone not white or a funny accent), immigration immigration, stealing our women folk and jobs, terrorists everywhere, muslims, long live Boris and the Daily Mail? (see I can make up stuff too)

Anyway my camalite friend lets try not to make assumptions about what each other thinks that way we might be able to have a sensible debate about a topic I can see your still bitter about (you won you know?) so until you can get over that then we really won't get anywhere.

Of course your 'guess' is wrong I'm happy to be part of Europe although I would have preferred to be part of it as an independent country I just have to bite the bullet and hope your compatriots aren't going to give into right wing Nationalism although admittedly that would be the quickest way to get another referendum and make your wish come true   

[jakswan]

Toxic SNP.. really Jak, obsessed much?? 

I would have thought a 'better together' boy would be voting in, Farage get to you did he?

Eh? I think its best for all that Scotland leave as soon as possible, or at least the issue gets settled.

I would assume your argument would be along the lines of long live little england, let's get rid of johnny foreigner (aka anyone not white or a funny accent), immigration immigration, stealing our women folk and jobs, terrorists everywhere, muslims, long live Boris and the Daily Mail? (see I can make up stuff too)

Well since I'm not English no nothing like that at all. I wasn't making anything up I took a post you wrote with regard to Scottish independence and changed a few words. 

The SNP are toxic in Wales.

Anyway my camalite friend lets try not to make assumptions about what each other thinks that way we might be able to have a sensible debate about a topic I can see your still bitter about (you won you know?) so until you can get over that then we really won't get anywhere.

You are being a hypocrite.

Of course your 'guess' is wrong I'm happy to be part of Europe although I would have preferred to be part of it as an independent country I just have to bite the bullet and hope your compatriots aren't going to give into right wing Nationalism although admittedly that would be the quickest way to get another referendum and make your wish come true   

Actually I'd guess you were for the European Union but against the Union.

Whilst Scotland haven't got a great football team they could make the Euro's of the whinging and moaning Championships.

[King Oberon]

Hmm hypocrite? Really? You are the one who put up what I was thinking so I took a tounge in cheek swipe at what you think, hardly hypocritical 

As for trying to get a bit of debate going like I say I am repeatedly reading your posts which obsessively prattle on about the SNP no matter what the subject so again, obsessed much!!

I guess your Welsh then pity you couldn't see past the biased media which got the tories in power down there despite what the 'mail' says people are either happy with the SNP up here or even if they aren't they dont have any 'real' alternatives.

Labour, tories and just London-centric and the Lib dems are a waste of space so the SNP win by default. I don't see how the SNP are toxic in Wales? Strange statement unless of course your just obsessing again and blaming them for squirrels stealing things from your fruit bowl 

So I change my little englander to little britlander.. that make you feel better? 

[jakswan]

Hmm hypocrite? Really? You are the one who put up what I was thinking so I took a tounge in cheek swipe at what you think, hardly hypocritical 

As for trying to get a bit of debate going like I say I am repeatedly reading your posts which obsessively prattle on about the SNP no matter what the subject so again, obsessed much!!

I guess your Welsh then pity you couldn't see past the biased media which got the tories in power down there despite what the 'mail' says people are either happy with the SNP up here or even if they aren't they dont have any 'real' alternatives.

Labour, tories and just London-centric and the Lib dems are a waste of space so the SNP win by default. I don't see how the SNP are toxic in Wales? Strange statement unless of course your just obsessing again and blaming them for squirrels stealing things from your fruit bowl 

So I change my little englander to little britlander.. that make you feel better? 

SNP come across as being toxic because the stand only for people that are Scottish. I'm interested in politics the SNPs impact has been massive on politics over the last year. I have always said SNP have brilliant politicians.

[Nearly Sane]

Jakswan comes across as toxic because the phrase civic nationalism seems struck for his vocabulary

[jakswan]

Jakswan comes across as toxic because the phrase civic nationalism seems struck for his vocabulary

Good ole spin.

[Nearly Sane]

Jakswan comes across as toxic because the phrase civic nationalism seems struck for his vocabulary

Good ole spin.

since I merely used the same process as you did that means your post was spin. You expressed an opinion, as did I.

[jakswan]

Jakswan comes across as toxic because the phrase civic nationalism seems struck for his vocabulary

Good ole spin.

since I merely used the same process as you did that means your post was spin. You expressed an opinion, as did I.

I said, admittedly based on anecdotal evidence, that the SNP are seen as toxic south of the border, this is due to the fact that the SNP only stand for people that are Scottish.

Adding civic to the word doesn't negate that point, the issue is with nationalism even if it is spun to be a more tolerant version than ethnic nationalism.

The tories claim to represent everyone, although I suspect many are not rich enough, the labour party claim to represent everyone.... the SNP only claim represent people who are Scottish.

[King Oberon]

I said, admittedly based on anecdotal evidence, that the SNP are seen as toxic south of the border, this is due to the fact that the SNP only stand for people that are Scottish.

Ah 'seen' as toxic.. fair enough perhaps by some but you have to see it from a Scottish point of view Jak, we had years and years of voting for Labour getting tory then Labour became tory lite so it is/was nice to actually vote for someone that do stand for us.

Adding civic to the word doesn't negate that point, the issue is with nationalism even if it is spun to be a more tolerant version than ethnic nationalism.

There's a difference between nationalism and self determination but you don't seem to see it.

I couldn't give a f where you came from if you live in Scotland you are part of this country and welcome unlike English Nationalism which tends to have a nasty mix of racism and introvertism and I object to being part of that even if it's only by loose association of the UK. 

The tories claim to represent everyone, although I suspect many are not rich enough, the labour party claim to represent everyone.... the SNP only claim represent people who are Scottish.

Well I would agree with the SNP definition and see nothing bad about it but from my view over the wall the Tories represent their rich mates and south England, Labour represent well I haven't a clue what labour represent they were a left wing party representing the workers but over the last 20 years they also have represented the their rich mates and the south of England even though they are trying to get back to what they were but in Scotland at least it's too late.

See we can debate it like adults 

[Outrider]

... fair enough perhaps by some but you have to see it from a Scottish point of view Jak, we had years and years of voting for Labour getting tory then Labour became tory lite so it is/was nice to actually vote for someone that do stand for us.

That's the nature of a democracy, though. We do get who we vote for - you want to reclassify who 'we' are here. I come from an area that's returned Lib Dems repeatedly, yet we've never 'had our turn', because that's not how it works. If you don't like the idea that you vote one way and don't get adequate representation, then don't withdraw, fight to change the system.

O.

[jakswan]

Ah 'seen' as toxic.. fair enough perhaps by some but you have to see it from a Scottish point of view Jak, we had years and years of voting for Labour getting tory then Labour became tory lite so it is/was nice to actually vote for someone that do stand for us.

I might well support the SNP if I qualified as Scottish, I doubt it though I've never been much of a nationalist of any flavour. I recall in the 1980s wondering why all my Welsh mates were supporting Argentina when they played England, oddly they don't seem to do that much now.

There's a difference between nationalism and self determination but you don't seem to see it.

I couldn't give a f where you came from if you live in Scotland you are part of this country and welcome unlike English Nationalism which tends to have a nasty mix of racism and introvertism and I object to being part of that even if it's only by loose association of the UK. 

Yes I understand there are different forms of nationalism but it is still nationalism. 

Well I would agree with the SNP definition and see nothing bad about it but from my view over the wall the Tories represent their rich mates and south England,

Yes the SNP represent a group and the Tories might represent another. Odd but the Tories have helped SNP thrive in Scotland and the SNP in turn helped the Tories win power.

I think parties that support everyone better represent everyone.

Labour represent well I haven't a clue what labour represent they were a left wing party representing the workers but over the last 20 years they also have represented the their rich mates and the south of England even though they are trying to get back to what they were but in Scotland at least it's too late.

See we can debate it like adults 

They always tried to represent the working people, lost their way it seems. There is still support of their ideology in Wales & many other parts of the UK. They will fight on I don't think people will all surrender even if the Scots have deserted them.

[Nearly Sane]

I think Labour and the Lib Dems have been much better at helping the Tories into power than the SNP

[JP]

I always find it amusing when two different people use the flag of their nation and one is a noble patriot while the other is a racist. Of course, there are no racists or racism in Scotland.

I always enjoy reading the comment in the HYS bit of some BBC articles.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-34533955

[jakswan]

I always find it amusing when two different people use the flag of their nation and one is a noble patriot while the other is a racist. Of course, there are no racists or racism in Scotland.

I always enjoy reading the comment in the HYS bit of some BBC articles.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-34533955

Who said anything about racism?

[JP]

Who said anything about racism?

KO alluded to it #285

I'm sure independence will not be far away, thank goodness, once the SNP manage to get a few more through the education system full of Scottishness & speaking Scots brainwashed with Bannockurn and the defeat of the evil English who tried to conquer their country, and once they pass legislation to let 12 years old on vote then they're onto a winner.

[JP]

Who said anything about racism?

KO alluded to it #285

I'm sure independence will not be far away, thank goodness, once the SNP manage to get a few more through the education system full of Scottishness & speaking Scots brainwashed with Bannockurn and the defeat of the evil English who tried to conquer their country, and once they pass legislation to let 12 years old and up vote then they're onto a winner.

[King Oberon]

I'm sure independence will not be far away, thank goodness, once the SNP manage to get a few more through the education system full of Scottishness & speaking Scots brainwashed with Bannockurn and the defeat of the evil English who tried to conquer their country, and once they pass legislation to let 12 years old on vote then they're onto a winner.

Hmm I would reply to this if there was anything that wasn't total bollocks but ... it all seems to be the same UKIP rhetoric that David Coburn comes out with and is soundly laughed at for saying so, any relation JP?